AST and Party Bonus Live Letter feedback.

[Mallik_Yggdrasil]

I'd also like to see Astrologians get a MIND party buff over the PIETY one..
The idea of being able to have different party buffs depending on active Sects is pretty cool though I don't think they'd implement that.

[randysquirrel]

Genuine question then, if having any healer gets the MND bonus, what even is the point of the bonus system? You would always have the MND bonus, unless you had a party with no healers at all, in which case who is even benefitting from the MND bonus anyway? WAR self-heal?

The whole system feels overly complicated, and not so much a bonus at all, just a detriment on the rare occasion you are missing one of them.

I mean would it be so game-breaking if they just gave you them all when in an 8-party composition?

[Ghishlain]

Genuine question then, if having any healer gets the MND bonus, what even is the point of the bonus system? You would always have the MND bonus, unless you had a party with no healers at all, in which case who is even benefitting from the MND bonus anyway? WAR self-heal?

The whole system feels overly complicated, and not so much a bonus at all, just a detriment on the rare occasion you are missing one of them.

I mean would it be so game-breaking if they just gave you them all when in an 8-party composition?

Eventually they'll probably end up either making the party bonus a "permanent bonus" when in a party or just do with it out right. As they release more and more jobs, there will be more and more combinations of jobs in any 8 man party. While their efficiency will vary, I imagine S-E doesn't want "party bonus" to be one of those deciding factors (similar to how they adjust Proshell to be available for cross class).

[Kerrigen]

The whole system feels overly complicated, and not so much a bonus at all, just a detriment on the rare occasion you are missing one of them.

I mean would it be so game-breaking if they just gave you them all when in an 8-party composition?

The answer is, it's a system that is doomed to be pointless in the long run, unless they make it a permanent bonus of sorts, or remove it outright, as Ghislain suggests.

It was introduced in 1.x to encourage taking multiple jobs because class stacking was a thing (Garuda BLM burn parties come to mind), and the jobs' output was affected by multiple stats (MNK was STR and INT, BRD was DEX and PIE, VIT used to affect Regen and Stoneskin's potency, etc.). It's obviously not relevant anymore as jobs are affected by a single stat that they bring as a party bonus anyway, unless you're a SCH or AST.

[Nekotee]

Yeah by the way the war self heal is similar to any DPS self heal.
Based on their attack power because they are not healing spell

The PAL clemency would be affect by the mind bonus...
But not sure.

In my opinion
They should either remove bonus as suggested
Or... Give piety its rightful place : SECONDARY STAT
(So full mnd for healers)

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

The PAL clemency would be affect by the mind bonus...
But not sure.

It's not. It's scaled off attack power, I think. As this value remains unchanged regardless of oath and fight or flight and your clemency values do not change either regardless of fight or flight or oaths

[Ghishlain]

It's not. It's scaled off attack power, I think. As this value remains unchanged regardless of oath and fight or flight and your clemency values do not change either regardless of fight or flight or oaths

Clemency does indeed scale off Attack Power.

That being said, Nekotee does have the right idea too.

Off the top of the head, these are party bonus that one job provides that other jobs benefit from:

• STR bonus from MNK/DRG helping Tank jobs with their enmity generation (+damage) and their heals / self-heals
• PIE bonus from AST/SCH helping BLMs with their rotation (slight bonus to BRD / MCH / SMN and their MP consumption)
• MND bonus from WHM helping AST/SCH with their healing and DPS
• (Minor) I believe one of the stats increases block / parry rate. Yes, yes, block / parry, but still a very minor consideration to have.

Currently, it's a small list, but given the amount of BLMs that have provided input into this MND/PIE discussion, I can see the list getting bigger and player's getting louder pending what new jobs are released and how their kits interface with the meta (IE, if DEX DPS becomes the meta next expansion, Tanks will speak out about wanting STR party bonus).

[Nekotee]

I should add that VIT benefit everyone to suuuuurvive !
And hell when you see the amount of damage everyone take in Alexander... Each vit point count !

Pray the twelve that tank will never have str bonus
I currently have nightmare when I have to babysit a half str tank in DF...

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

(Minor) I believe one of the stats increases block / parry rate. Yes, yes, block / parry, but still a very minor consideration to have.

They changed this with the 3.0 patch. Prior to the expansion, str increased block/parry strength and dex increased block/parry rate - With extremely minor gains as well. Now neither do anything in regards of blocking or parrying

[technole]

Party bonus is still rather relevant. Rotations all the way down to theory crafting had been done to optimize based on party bonuses such as BLM/PIE (it's even a thing to meld PIE onto BLM gear). More importantly when you are Alex savage raiding in under-geared progression you want every passive stat increase you can get. You don't see any world progression groups, let alone regular raid groups without nearly the perfect party setup. Granted, World Midas #3 had AST/SCH. That is more to say you don't MND bonus to clear, but lets not discount how much STR matters for DPS progression for tanks too. Among other things.

The simplest way to resolve and satisfy all is the first healer is always MND, second healer that isn't the same job as the first will add PIE. That would always discourage same job party setup, which is sort of the point of the party bonus by bringing synchronized/right jobs to the table.