Beast Tribes of Eorzea discussion (Potential Spoilers)

[Alberel]

I think people are underestimating the Vath quite a bit here. Yes, their society as we see it now is fairly primitive but that it because they have only recently broken free from the Onemind and struck out on their own. They're still discovering themselves.

Judging from the daily quests they are extremely good at assimilating cultures and learning from them. They may not be advanced right now but they have the potential for extremely rapid development once they have some stability.

[Frederick22]

In order, from a purely technological standpoint:

Tech Advancement:
1. Goblins
2. Ixal
3. Kobolds
4. Gnath (Vath)
... the rest don't use much more than basic smithing techniques, if that.

Primal Origins:
1. Ifrit (Amal'jaa): unknown. Presumably some kind of desert spirit, I think?
2. Titan (Kobolds): unknown. Likely a father figure from myth, based on his quotes and personality.
3. Garuda (Ixal): From the Final Fantasy Wiki: "Garuda [is] the Primal worshiped by the Ixal, and is known as the Empress of Birds. It is said that in past ages, Garuda slew the malevolent Lord of Snakes to end his foul attempt to bind the world's creatures to the earth. Though birds became free to roam the skies, Garuda was terribly wounded by the battle and was forced to feast upon the snake's carcass to recover her energies, said to have since then a taste for the flesh of land-bound mortals."
4. Good King Moggle Mog XII (Moogles): based on a chieftain that led some moogles away from the Churning Mists in time immemorial.
5. Leviathan (Sahagin): unknown. Seems to be a manifestation of their rage, but that's all we have.
6. Ramuh (Sylphs): based on "the old man in the wood," a forest-dwelling hermit sage. (Harsh behavior is likely due to the summoning process, which tends to corrupt the primal to its worst possible interpretation - see "Good King Moggle Mog XII is essentially a genocidal tyrant." That said, easily the most agreeable non-channeled primal.)
7. Ravana (Gnath): based on a great warrior of myth, I believe. Story is somewhat elaborated on in the quest to unlock Ravana EX. (Popular hypothesis is that he's based on Phantom Ray, the first boss of the Fractal Continuum, but beyond the two sharing a skeleton there's nothing hinting at this.)
8. Bismarck (Vanu Vanu): based on a being from Vanu Vanu creation myth. Bismarck was the only white one of His black brethren, who killed Him in jealousy. Taking pity on Bismarck, the Gods resurrected Him and gave Him the ability to fly, and Bismarck took with Him into the sky the Sea of Clouds. (The Bismarck encountered in-game, obviously, is not this Bismarck.)
9. Alexander (Goblins): detailed in the Alexander raids.

Origins:
Amal'jaa: unknown.
Kobolds: unknown.
Ixal: genetically degraded Iksalion from Azys Lla. (They even mention it in some text as "Ayatlan," a paradise, and one Ixal in the Ehcatl Nine camp even has new dialogue once you've been there. A panel in the Fractal Continuum confirms this.)
Moogles: unknown.
Sahagin: unknown.
Sylphs: unknown.
Gnath: unknown. (If the above "Ravana is based on Phantom Ray" is true, they too could be an Allagan-engineered race. A hive mind would certainly be useful for issuing commands...)
Vanu Vanu: unknown. (Hypothesized to be an Allagan creation due to them guarding the key to Azys Lla and treating it like a sacred object... until Bismarck ate it.)
Goblins: unknown.

In call cases of "unknown," it's possible (if not likely) they're simply a naturally-occurring species.

But Cilia now that we have confirmation of the Ixali's orginis, we cannot, at least speculate, the origins of Garuda as well?

Could have being an Ixal or an Allagan, that wanted to free them and so beacuse their leader on their path to the promise land. ( Moises story reference )

[Zadocfish]

I just did the Titan quest, and I must say the Kobolds changed my ideas about Limsa Lominsa, at least. They royally screwed up in keeping a treaty with the Kobolds, and when they summoned Titan in retaliation we barely got a "woopsie!" out of the leader. I know it's a town of pirates, but c'mon... They brought everything on themselves and made life way worse for the Kobolds, and made them enemies, for some petty crap...

Did make me like the Kobolds better, though I had to kill quite a few.

[Unittj]

I just did the Titan quest, and I must say the Kobolds changed my ideas about Limsa Lominsa, at least. They royally screwed up in keeping a treaty with the Kobolds, and when they summoned Titan in retaliation we barely got a "woopsie!" out of the leader. I know it's a town of pirates, but c'mon... They brought everything on themselves and made life way worse for the Kobolds, and made them enemies, for some petty crap...

Did make me like the Kobolds better, though I had to kill quite a few.

Y'shtola's word bashing of the Admiral was quite deserved. "Beastmen are people too" ideals seem to don't hold well in the popular concensus in the city-states.

[AdamZ]

When you get to the high-end Orders.

Is that not the case with most ARR beast tribes? In many cases we have only seen the low rank and outposts. So anyone from the Amal'jaa, Kobolds, Sahagin could have much more advanced technology then we have seen?

[Belhi]

Y'shtola's word bashing of the Admiral was quite deserved. "Beastmen are people too" ideals seem to don't hold well in the popular concensus in the city-states.

It varies quite a bit. Its worth noting that a number of the beast tribes (Untempered Sylphs, Qiqirn and Goblins) seem to be treated and respected fine. The conflict tends to be born out of the same reason conflict is often born, disagreement over resources when it isn't directly primal related. Of course that isn't universal but trade and communication between the citystates and the Beast tribes has been common enough in the past. The Ashcrown Concortium was build on such trade. Even now the Kobald's will still deal indirectly with elements from the Limsa.

The thing with primals though is realistically the primal will enevitably harm the summoning tribe just through the insatiable hunger for Aether and the influence it has on their culture. You see with the Amal'jaa the traditional honor based culture eroding as they switch to a culture of dependency and feeling Ifrit Aether and worshipers. Likewise, the tempering has turned the Sylph's cruel and hateful, leading to them poisoning their own forests just to keep everyone out.

[Zadocfish]

Adding to the Kobold thing above, now that I've reached THAT part of the story: If the dragons count as a beast race against Ishgard, I would side with them 100%. I want to see that place full of stuck-up, self-righteous barbarian jackasses burn.

[Khalithar]

So anyone from the Amal'jaa, Kobolds, Sahagin could have much more advanced technology then we have seen?

Kobolds maybe. We're shown that the leader of the 13th order has all kidns advanced alchemy stuff we destroy. So that's possible.

Amal'Jaa I doubt it. They are shown to use largely primitive technology and rely almost entirely on ifrit's magical power.

Sahagin I doubt it as well. Mostly because they live under water and the daily quests show that they are conscripting other races for their level of tech.

[Belhi]

Adding to the Kobold thing above, now that I've reached THAT part of the story: If the dragons count as a beast race against Ishgard, I would side with them 100%. I want to see that place full of stuck-up, self-righteous barbarian jackasses burn.

I wont spoil it but the Dragons aren't really a beast tribe. Moreover the conflict between the two groups is far more complicated than most of the conflicts the city states have with the beast tribes.

[Rashammel]

I don't know about thecnology and knowledge but I think, from the enemys beast tribe, Kobolds is the more "civilized" tribe, the armorer quest hint about they trading goods whit limsa in the past. Silphys are pacific, but they don't look 'civilized", what I remeber from de MSQ is they like to make pranks whit the people living in the East Shrould, and even in the daily quest the bad silphy looks dumb.
The Ixial and the Amal'Jaa looks more savage, and less inclined to have a pacific relationship whit the city state. In both tribes you have a little faction of them willing to acept a pacific approach.
I did little in the Sahagin beast tribe, but from the start of the quest they look likes the more diverse beast tribe, they all server the Indigo Matriach, and have the goal of breeding they offrispring, but every "father" choose the way they will live.
Gnath is the less "civilized", because of the One mind is hard for them to be have a pacific realtionship whit Ishigard, and from the Ravana quest line, the One mind looks like a kind of expansionist king.
Vanu we have two factions willing to have a pacific relationship, but the most powerful faction have a agressive posture against Ishigard.
TL;DR Kobolds looks like the more "civilized" imo.