Why does S-E make it so hard for new players to clear old content the intended way?

[Pence]

Maybe SE could add incentives to running stuff synced or at min ilevel, such as boosted drop rates?

They've already done this with 3.2, the primal music drops will be 100% while synced iirc.

[Lambdafish]

They've already done this with 3.2, the primal music drops will be 100% while synced iirc.

Not 100% iirc, just "higher"

[Lexia]

As this person said

It's not an SE issue, it's a player/human nature issue.

So SE has nothing to do with it, if you run DF by yourself it syncs group and in PF group has a option of whether they want to run synced or unsynced.

[Takfloyd]

The casual player base is where SE's money comes from so no, sadly. New players will never be able to experience pre-nerf coils especially, even clicking off the echo buff will not make it the same because the fights themselves have been modified mechanically to be easier than they used to be. What you say is true that some people may be ultra turned off by the game seeing there's so much content they won't actually get to experience and just have to rush to Heavensward to try to be included in the current patch, but not enough for SE to be hurting to do something about it.

It's not about needing the fights to be as hard as when they first came out, obviously that's unreasonable since the raiding scene has long since moved on.

It's just about making the basic mechanics still meaningful and not turning the whole fight into pure cheese that lasts for half a minute before the boss dies.

Echo is fine. Some overgearing is fine. Even mechanic nerfs are fine as long as the mechanic isn't removed altogether.

But going in with twice the ilvl you're supposed to have and 10 more levels including new abilities, then pressing 1 2 3 until all the bosses are dead, and then getting all the rewards? That's not okay. That's called butchering content.

So SE has nothing to do with it, if you run DF by yourself it syncs group and in PF group has a option of whether they want to run synced or unsynced.

SE has nothing to do with allowing that option in the first place, and thus making doing it by DF completely impossible because no one else does it?

[Pence]

Not 100% iirc, just "higher"

Another new item is the orchestrion - can you tell us about the availability of the music scores? When you introduced it in the producer letter live, it sounded like content that could be challenged with minimum item-level sync. Will the drops change under those conditions?

Yoshida: No, you don't need to use the minimum IL sync to get drops. However, if you clear the extreme primals at the minimum IL sync, it will be a guaranteed drop.

Extreme primals at the minimum item level.... Will the drop rate go up in normal primals as well at the minimum item level?

Yoshida: Because that would be too easy, it won't change in the normal primals. The regular drop rate should feel similar to Triple Triad cards.

[Takfloyd]

Another new item is the orchestrion - can you tell us about the availability of the music scores? When you introduced it in the producer letter live, it sounded like content that could be challenged with minimum item-level sync. Will the drops change under those conditions?

Yoshida: No, you don't need to use the minimum IL sync to get drops. However, if you clear the extreme primals at the minimum IL sync, it will be a guaranteed drop.

Extreme primals at the minimum item level.... Will the drop rate go up in normal primals as well at the minimum item level?

Yoshida: Because that would be too easy, it won't change in the normal primals. The regular drop rate should feel similar to Triple Triad cards.

This is a step in the right direction, but again it sounds like more polarization between top level raiders and complete casuals. I doubt most new players want to do the fights at minimum ilvl, and farming parties at minimum ilvl won't accept them anyway. And of course, this doesn't at all solve the problem of empty Duty Finders. Why couldn't they just make the songs unobtainable in unsynced, making regular synced DF runs the main option?

[Pence]

This is a step in the right direction, but again it sounds like more polarization between top level raiders and complete casuals. I doubt most new players want to do the fights at minimum ilvl, and farming parties at minimum ilvl won't accept them anyway. And of course, this doesn't at all solve the problem of empty Duty Finders. Why couldn't they just make the songs unobtainable in unsynced, making regular synced DF runs the main option?

......Ah perhaps because it's old outdated content that's near 2+ years old? If you want to do it the old way, knock yourself out - you even get a bonus for it now. But it shouldn't be forced on people. I feel like you're crying about spilt milk.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

You have to understand that a certain level of proactive focus on new content - when it's new - is required of you if you want to experience the "original" versions of old content. This can't be held against players who perhaps start late, or have reasons/obligations that keep them away at length, of course, but it's not reason to simply leave it static either.

As content ages and new content (gear, weps, etc.) replaces it, the content will naturally be eased even without Echo or unsyncing. Still, anything difficult that was generally avoided by most would not age well when those who actively challenged it move on. Coil is an example of this. SE has effectively breathed new life into it with new incentives, and the genius idea of guaranteed drops for challenging at min. ilvl.

No, you will never get to experience instant killer Blighted Bouquet (outside of T6S), but if you want a taste of the original challenge, there are options and new incentive to at least try.

[FunkYeahDragons]

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. If SE removed unsynced, chances are we'd have groups of experienced players only farming them. I can't blame raiders for not wanting to do the same challenges over and over again when there's new content coming up.

Plus... synced only does so much. I went into T1 synced early on with a group of friends expecting to get wrecked, but we beat it on our first try and we weren't even very good. I just had this sense of "That's all?"

But I agree that it's disheartening to have to push all the way to the end to get to the active challenges. There's a point where unsynced EX primals are too easy but many other things are still out of your reach. At one point, Friday Night Wolves' Den was the only reason I didn't let my sub expire.

[Lexia]

It's not about needing the fights to be as hard as when they first came out, obviously that's unreasonable since the raiding scene has long since moved on.

It's just about making the basic mechanics still meaningful and not turning the whole fight into pure cheese that lasts for half a minute before the boss dies.

Echo is fine. Some overgearing is fine. Even mechanic nerfs are fine as long as the mechanic isn't removed altogether.

But going in with twice the ilvl you're supposed to have and 10 more levels including new abilities, then pressing 1 2 3 until all the bosses are dead, and then getting all the rewards? That's not okay. That's called butchering content.



SE has nothing to do with allowing that option in the first place, and thus making doing it by DF completely impossible because no one else does it?

Yea cause it so bad SE gives people options.