That Garlean guy, what was his name? Gaius Van Baelsar

[Nalien]

Dude... I literally just clarified what I said...

I said inform them, not allying with them...

Telling everyones favorite "Lets kill this entire tribe because they summoned a Primal" Empire that Ishgard summoned a Primal =/= becoming BFFs with said Empire... He can very easily talk with them, the same way we're able to occasionally talk with them, being shot at first doesn't stop us from chatting with them after killing a few dozen of them.

Like I also said, if he was going for an all or nothing assault, he missed his chance. You'd want to do something like that while they're still confused and fighting each other... You know, like what was happening in 3.1? Instead, we get news that he has flown off to "skies unknown" in the same patch... He is up to something...

Is the same, he hates all humans. Why he would toss them some info?

Like I said, to have them fight each other... Who benefits the most from a Garlean/Eorzean conflict? Garlemald would have losses, Eorzea would have losses, the mortal hating Dragon would get a good laugh out of it all, though.

He also doesn't hate all mortals equally... If that were the case, he wouldn't have restricted himself to 1,000 years on Ishgard. He has a very specific axe to grind with them at this point. Giving the Empire a good reason to declare war on them would totally be in Nidhoggs interests.

Why the garleans would trust him? just with seen him, they will try to kill the dragon xD

Do we actually have any indication that Garlemald hates dragons and would kill them on sight? They had some dirty business with Midgardsormr, but were I in their shoes, that would make something like Nidhogg knocking on my front door all the more interesting...

As for why they'd trust him... They saw Ysayle summon Shiva to take down their fancy new warship, if I was in the dark I'd probably not know what to make of that, but then if someone pops by and tells me Ishgard summoned a God-King? Then things start fitting into place; Eorzea has people summoning Primals, better at least go check that out. Thus, an escalation of Eorzean/Garlean conflicts ready for 4.0.

[Frederick22]

Dude... I literally just clarified what I said...



Telling everyones favorite "Lets kill this entire tribe because they summoned a Primal" Empire that Ishgard summoned a Primal =/= becoming BFFs with said Empire...

Is the same, he hates all humans. Why he would toss them some info? he isnt even up his right mind to beging with
Why the garleans would trust him? just with seen him, they will try to kill the dragon xD

[Cilia]

snip

It's actually very important. If you recall one of the many infodumps after a primal battle in 2.x - specifically, post-Leviathan (2.2) - Ascians need to use a Dark Crystal to flee to the Interstitial World between our plane and the Aetherial Sea to avoid death. That's why Igeyorhm pulled hers out and tried to use it, only to get a facefull of White Auracite and get blasted to pieces.

Lahabrea, on the other hand, did not. In our first encounter with him after the Ultima Weapon, his Dark Crystal was readied and attached to the choker Thancred was wearing, giving him an easy out if things went south. He was just toying around with us back then. In the second fight, he's going all out more or less, and without a human host doesn't expect we'll win. We end up flooring him even after he does a Fusion Dance with Igeyorhm, but with only the one auracite spent on Igeyorhm, have nothing left to deal with Lahabrea. He still thinks he's going to live to fight another day. In comes Pope Thordan, who double-crosses the Ascian and kills him - all the while Lahabrea cannot believe this is happening. Never takes out his Dark Crystal to flee. While his aether was absorbed by Nidhogg's eye instead of Thordan himself, that makes little difference - he was blasted apart into raw aether by that point, no consciousness left. He didn't escape because he was too shocked by the fact he actually lost on all accounts and prior to Thordan backstabbing him thought he was going to get away, and what was left of him by the time Nidhogg's eye absorbed him was only aether. A large quantity, but only aether regardless.

As for what Nidhogg's doing, that's beyond me. I have no idea and generally refrain from baseless speculation. The only thing we know for sure is that he and his brood are going somewhere Hraesvelgr and/or Vidofnir don't know. I personally believe that Estinien may be influencing him from the inside, but that's just me.

Nidhogg didn't actually "survive" or "come back" in the same way the Ascians do. This is going into the realm of conjecture, but since dragons' eyes contain their lifeforce, with enough aether (like the amount contained in an Ascian soul, perhaps? Nice job making our lives even more miserable, old Pope Thordan!) it's not unreasonable to think one could reconstitute their body. The "real" Nidhogg is dead, and we're just fighting a phantasm comprised of his hatred that's using Estinien's body to gain a corporeal form now.

When it comes to making deductions, possible < plausible < probable. While your speculations are plausible, I don't personally think they're very probable (or would rather wait and see what happens before making a guess).

[Nalien]

While his aether was absorbed by Nidhogg's eye instead of Thordan himself, that makes little difference - he was blasted apart into raw aether by that point, no consciousness left.

I wonder about this... Given how surprised they all were when we killed Nabriales, I'm doubtful being "blasted apart" is actually a kill state, but rather an inconvenience... I mean... They were fairly shocked that Nabriales kicked the bucket... They didn't seem aware they could actually be killed, yet they handed out Escape Ropes with the intent purpose of "If you're about to be killed, use this"? That's... Stupid? If being blasted apart is just a matter of "Great, now I've got to speed weeks putting myself back together, and the rest of the guys are gonna laugh at me!" though? Then the Escape Rope makes sense. Putting yourself back together is a hassle, better to warp out before that occurs for a speedier recovery. Seems more like it's a KO'd state, rather than death. Annoying, and worth avoiding, but not life threatening on its own. If Dark Crystals were handed out with the express purpose of avoiding death, then the whole shock that they can die strikes me as incredibly stupid...

I might need to go back and check the cutscenes, but wasn't the aether trail left by Lahabrea being blasted distinctly Ascian-y? Where as the resultant of blasting White Auracite was not? I'm thinking the order matters here. Absorbing them in Auracite, then blasting that into nothing is a kill state. Being blasted then absorbed is, well, just being absorbed. His aether is still knocking around Nidhoggs right eye, whether it reforms into himself is another matter. Meanwhile, Igeyorhms aether (and Nabriales before her) is just gone.

Going back and watching it, the way the Eye absorbs Lahabrea is fairly similar to the way White Auracite absorbed Nabriales. The only difference is that Nabriales wasn't blasted before hand, and the Eye wasn't blasted to destroy it after absorbing Lahabrea... If one was blasted into pieces, I imagine it would be fairly convenient to then be absorbed into one place after... Either way, his aether is now part of Nidhogg. Whether that means he'll be back or not is anther matter, but Lahabrea is in a distinctly different scenario than Nabriales and Igeyorhm. Their aether was trapped and blasted, Lahabrea was blasted and trapped. The former lends itself to utter destruction, while the later leaves the possibility of escape.

Then from his soul Aether being in close proximity Thordin was then able to swalow Lahabrea's soul. Because to a primal, Aether is Aether.

Except it was Nidhoggs Eye in the Ascalon which absorbed Lahabrea, not Thordan. The animation is very specific, and similar to Nabriales being absorbed by the White Auracite which, of course, did not kill Nabriales.

That's where the doubt lies; Lahabrea was absorbed by the Eye, and the Eye is still intact. Nabriales and Igeyorhm were absorbed by Auracite, then we blasted the Auracite into nothingness. Until that Eye is blasted into nothingness, there is (IMO) a chance Lahabrea can break out, the same way Nabriales threatened to break out of the Auracite before we destroyed it. Trapping an Ascians aether seems to be only half the battle, and Thordan skipped the second step...

[Kaiser-Ace]

Ok, when we curb stomped Acian prime we dammage Lahabrea and Igorium's coporoal forms forcing their souls to take a dark Aether appearance akin to how the Sahagin Elder cheated death.

The Dark Crystals act as an "On Shit" plan of that happens now that they know they're not unkillable. We traped Igyorim first because she was holding the Crystal and then compleatly obliterated her soul with Nidhogg's Eye.

In this time Lahabrea had regained coporial form and taunted that the eye was drained and we were out of Auracite. Then enters Kill Jacker Thorden who turns Thorden's Corpse into The Ascalon Blade and destroys Lahabrea's newly stabalized coporial body with the sword.

Then from his soul Aether being in close proximity Thordin was then able to swalow Lahabrea's soul. Because to a primal, Aether is Aether.

[Kotemon]

Darth Vader didn't die when he fought Obiwan. With an ending that open ended it's probably left to interpretation whether he died or not. If they ever get to an actual Omega weapon, well find out then if he's dead or not.

[Phyllo]

Skip

As nalien said, you're mixing up the order of things, to kill an ascian you need to first entrap them THEN destroy them, meaning nothing is left after the "blast" which is what happened with nebriales and igheyorn or however it's spelled, the difference is that lahabrea got blasted first THEN absorbed, meaning the blasting away only separated his body, it didn't killed him otherwise there'd be nothing to absorb, thordan would had absorbed igheyorn's remains as well if there was lingering a ether after the kill.

Hence lahabrea wasn't killed but entrapped only and I wouldn't count the sagagin as relevant, nothing says he died, all we know is that he got absorbed (till we killed it's container leviathan that is)

so all in all this is what happened in a nutshell we killed ighewimp by capturing her then blasting her with the eye> thordan shows up and captures lahabrea into niddhog's eye > we kill thordan and his sword remains > estinnien gets his eye back from us and rips the other off ascalon > niddhog uses this chance to overload estinnien with power and corrupts him to recreate his body then flies away to "unknown skies"

I keep re reading and nope, I don't see anywhere the part where lahabrea's container, the eye, is shattered, meaning lahabrea is most likely alive inside niddhog and will most likely use him for his plans as well.
It wouldn't even surprise me if they pull a "killing niddhog ends up freeing lahabrea along with estinien"

Also, one thing you need to know about writing is that nothing is left and much less focused on if it's not gonna serve a direct or future purpose, ascalon being left there is obviously a hint that something will happen to it although not necessarily linked to the main scenario(unless they forget about it and it ends up being a loose end)

[Cilia]

Either way, his aether is now part of Nidhogg. Whether that means he'll be back or not is anther matter, but Lahabrea is in a distinctly different scenario than Nabriales and Igeyorhm. Their aether was trapped and blasted, Lahabrea was blasted and trapped. The former lends itself to utter destruction, while the later leaves the possibility of escape.

Possible < Plausible < Probable.

Back on point - ultimately, what it comes down to is that there is no evidence to support Lahabrea still being alive in any form beyond what you want to construe, while there is evidence to the contrary and the story presents itself as if he is dead dead. The quest log states that, as his first act as God-King, Thordan "executed" Lahabrea (it doesn't go into further detail), and Elidibus later comments that both he and Igeyorhm were "bested by mortals" and had "fallen" due to their complacency. Flowery language aside, he's saying they were defeated and killed by us because they were too arrogant to believe we could actually do so. Both of them. If anyone knew Lahabrea were still alive in some manner, it would definitely be Elidibus... yet he seems convinced the former is dead. (Does anyone have another language's version of that dialogue for clarification? The English script tends to be rather baroque and thus prone to people misinterpreting it or just being vague. I doubt that would convince some people, but even so I'd like to decisively end this.)

Thordan just skipped the "trapping the Ascian soul in an auracite" by overpowering Lahabrea without using an Auracite. What happens to an Ascian's soul after it's destroyed via Auraicte -> Blade of Light remains unknown, but there's no reason to believe that one-two punch is the only way to permanently kill an Ascian Overlord. (Hell, it wasn't until the Seventh Astral Era anyone believed killing an Ascian was even possible at all!)

Again, it's possible, plausible even, but there's no evidence supporting it, so it's improbable.

Darth Vader didn't die when he fought Obiwan. With an ending that open ended it's probably left to interpretation whether he died or not. If they ever get to an actual Omega weapon, well find out then if he's dead or not.

The difference is that we all knew Obi-Wan wasn't going to kill Vader on Mustafar; they both had to survive to fill their roles in the original trilogy, while Vader had yet to be put into his iconic suit. Logically, the only conclusion possible at that point was that Obi-Wan would spare him (or at least not kill him outright) and something would end up forcing Vader to get his cybernetics and suit. (Kenobi dismembers his remaining organic limbs and leaves Vader to die by the bank of a lava flow, only for Palpatine to arrive just in time to save him by sensing Vader being in danger. Not sure if that qualifies as a deus ex machina or a diabolus ex machina, given Palpatine's character and role...)

Here, we have Elidibus (Lahabrea's intended handler, more or less) commenting that he has fallen (modern English: was killed) due to his complacency (arrogance).

It is a bit open-ended - just a little - but there's nothing that really proves Lahabrea is still alive in any capacity beyond what you want to construe into supporting it while ignoring everything against it. That's called "willful ignorance," or at least preferring your personal interpretation over concrete fact.

Also, one thing you need to know about writing is that nothing is left and much less focused on if it's not gonna serve a direct or future purpose, ascalon being left there is obviously a hint that something will happen to it although not necessarily linked to the main scenario(unless they forget about it and it ends up being a loose end)

Ascalon was left behind because it had Nidhogg's other eye embedded in it, and that was important in Nidhogg's lingering hatred possessing Estinien. That is why Ascalon lingered after Thordan's defeat - that and as Haldrath's transmogrified casket and corpse, it wouldn't make causal sense for it to disappear with him.

Again, there's nothing stating the only way to perma-kill an Ascian is the Auracite -> Blade of Light combo. Most likely, Thordan just overpowered Lahabrea's weakened soul without the Auracite using his absurd power level and owing to the fact he was already worn down from our long fight. Essentially, he did what we do, just substituting brute force for our Auracite.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Right preaty much all the way, except we're imprisoning the conscious soul in the Auracite to separate it from surrounding Aether so it can't run/reform (as happened in the Pretorium). Then we hit the Auracite with the blade of light (Large beam of pure Aether) to obliterate the soul and return the base Aether to the lifestreem.

Thorden basically did this in reverse. He used Ascalon to reduce Lahabrea to Aether, then he ate him.

[MagiusNecros]

Lahabrea is probably dead. I can see them bringing Estinien back though. Nidhogg and Estinien might be at odds with fighting over control of the Dragon's body. Maybe why Nidhogg temporarily leaves Ishgard alone. Or Nidhogg wants Ishgard to rebuild before tearing it back down again.