Suggestion for GMs in handling reports of player threats of self harm

[Spawnie]

knew a guy once years ago.. he had habit of telling people he was gonna kill himself when things didnt go his way.. if no1 brought him a drink/food/ anything really he would say im gonna kill myself, no1 likes or cares about me then would go ring lifeline and annoy them for hour or so... one day another mate heard him say it for the 500th time didnt help being drunk at the time turned around n said do it and gave him a knife (which i thought was wrong and sick imo)... ever since that day he never threatened to kill himself again lol

problem is threats of self harm you always have to take serious since you have no way of knowing if they will or not but in most cases it isnt a cry for attention they really do feel they would be better off ending themselves which is sad

[Kosmos992k]

Players and especially Free Company leaders who find themselves dealing with situations like this, tread very carefully. As uncaring as it sounds, sometimes the best possible advise that the person takes a break from a potentially harmful (for their health) environment online and they seek help from someone close to them in real life, or from medical professionals. You are not and can not be their therapist, it really, really doesn't work that way.

Yes, you always have to take these things seriously, but very often these things are not as serious as they seem. Years, and years ago on USENET newsgroups I was part of a community that lost two regular and prominent posters to completely different circumstances. In one case, the poster passed away due to illness and of course there was grief. In the other case, the poster died a hero protecting people in a store robbery, and there was grief;
...except he didn't die, there was no robbery. It was entirely faked by the real person behind the posting identity/personality people had conversed with for *years*. Then there was much anger, feelings of betrayal and hurt. Looking back, this person clearly had major issues, or else they would not have done what they did. So it was serious, but not as serious as it might at first seem.

The point being you do not know what the reality of the person's situation is; you aren't their therapist/counselor. The absolute best thing you can do is support them by advising that they seek help in the real world, and contact a GM since as Enkrateia related, SE does have policy and procedure to handle these situations.

Of course leave the door open for such players to return when they are healthier, but as a FC master you have to protect your other members from harm also. They don't need or deserve to handle this kind of drama and stress.

I'm company master in FFXIV, and was a guild leader prior to moving to FFXIV. I've experienced many (more than my members ever knew about) situations ranging from unwitting behavior that was smoothed out and worked through, all the way to unstable stalkers threatening themselves in order to force me to comply with their wishes. Sometimes talking to a person really helps them, but not because you are taking the role of therapist, it's because you're taking the role of friend, which is in many cases all that is needed. Sometimes you have to give a person the space and time they need to work through their situation, sometimes you have to act quickly to prevent things from spiraling out of control.

It's never easy. But, in a sense, as guild leader/FC master, you accepted responsibility to handle these situations, just be careful how you do, and leave the professional services to the professionals.

.. OPs post. They kicked this person out of the FC for very good reasons - to protect themself and the person aswell. From what I understand that enviroment the Fc provided was rather harmful for that person but they didnt wanted to leave. That not only made the situation worse for themself but also for everyone else in the FC
**snip**
Sometimes the best help you can provide is "forcing" someone into professional, medical care and to tell someone to resolve their issues first.
**snip** Please, dont make "fun" of people who actually had good intention and were intelligent enough to find a solution that works for them while still caring about said person.

Well said.

I remember a similar case in my fc. Though it wasn't this serious, the fc master was able to have a long chat with the person involved and that seemed to have resolved it. He/she is no longer in the fc anymore though.

With the best will in the world, there are some things that it's hard to come back after.

[m3eansean]

This is why I dont really like MMO's anymore. Sometimes, I feel we all forget we are playing a game, which is supposed to be an interface in which you have fun -- a small escape from our daily lives.

I think it is an intense invasion of privacy to assume that a private company will track your IP address, inform your internet provider and ask them to divulge your physical location to the police so that they may visit your home, over what you allegedly said or did in an online game. Big Brother much?

Personal opinions/issues aside from the matter at hand, just my 2 cents.

[Kosmos992k]

This is why I dont really like MMO's anymore. Sometimes, I feel we all forget we are playing a game, which is supposed to be an interface in which you have fun -- a small escape from our daily lives.

I think it is an intense invasion of privacy to assume that a private company will track your IP address, inform your internet provider and ask them to divulge your physical location to the police so that they may visit your home, over what you allegedly said or did in an online game. Big Brother much?

Personal opinions/issues aside from the matter at hand, just my 2 cents.

How is it an intense invasion of privacy? Knowing your IP address means nothing. SE has your account record on file, they know your address and other information. Your IP address is worthless, you might be proxied through a VPN. It's hardly an invasion of privacy to scrape an IP address from a packet and so a lookup for the owner of the address either.

Perhaps you're forgetting that it's real people playing a game? Real people have real problems.

Let's turn this around, if there was a player threatening to end their life if people were not nice to them. How long would it be before some jerk yanks their chain just to see what they will do? Realistically, there is the potential for great harm, and SE already has the information they need at their disposal to potentially avert that harm.

[m3eansean]

SE knows a billing address willing provided to them and a credit card number.

To assume the police would visit the person at their home was the most invasive aspect IMO.

Nothing this person writes is admissible as evidence in any legal way. There is no way to confirm the person registered to the account, is making these statements at all. To suggest that a private company make decisions about whether police should be dispatched to a persons residence is alarming, in my opinion.

It opens the door too wide for any kind of speech that anyone deems threatening or unusual on a relatively anonymous platform, to incur some kind of investigation from local authorities. Not to mention various nations have various laws regarding speech and it's protection.

[Twilite]

I vehemently disagree with Pence on this.

While there is a 99.9% chance that these "suicide threats" are just attention-seeking, immature brat behaviour...

As much as you or anyone else would want to be right about that, you really need to study the affects depression has on the mind and how a person thinks when they are suicidal. The WORST thing you can do is not take someone like seriously, because often times, they will go through with it.

Hopefully that player didn't do so.. and got away from FFXIV. This community isn't for people with depression.

[SnugglesD]

(Snipped)The WORST thing you can do is not take someone like seriously, because often times, they will go through with it.

Hopefully that player didn't do so.. and got away from FFXIV. This community isn't for people with depression.

First, all MMOs are for people with depression. Its part of the mindset that people have to have to sink a part time job's worth of time into a fantasy life. It just comes with the culture.

Second, the real worst thing one can do is not to be skeptical about threats of suicide, but to think that they should try and help. I get being empathetic and wanting to do something, but attempting to do the work of a professional that has been trained for that exact situation can do more harm than good. Unless you've been trained in psychology, tread carefully and try to keep your distance without being dismissive. A person's life is not something that should be gambled on hoping you know how to deal with the situation.

[Fynlar]

This sort of thing really isn't SE's responsibility.

[hagare]

This is why I dont really like MMO's anymore. Sometimes, I feel we all forget we are playing a game, which is supposed to be an interface in which you have fun -- a small escape from our daily lives.

I think it is an intense invasion of privacy to assume that a private company will track your IP address, inform your internet provider and ask them to divulge your physical location to the police so that they may visit your home, over what you allegedly said or did in an online game. Big Brother much?

Personal opinions/issues aside from the matter at hand, just my 2 cents.

And sometimes people forget that there's a very real person behind an avatar.
And sometimes people forget that other people's situation can be radically different than your own.