How to Dragoon per Second: A DPS Paradigm

[MiniTyra]

Anyone know what Dervy's new rotation is? He put up a vid a week back that he could parse 1633 with party buff + food (dunno which one) + pots.

(I tried with 1 star hq food hq drac str potions, and 2 asts + 1 ninja + 1 mch, which got me 1805 and 1826, so fun XD).

and my second question is, how do I calculate stat weights for lets say the thordan wep and the relic, so I can compare? I mean multiplying the numbers is easy and all, but how do I see what is better for future refs? Kinda want to calculate on my own lmao

ty!

(hi!)

The Rotation isn't just the opening burst. Well, sort of is. The opener, I've realised, allows you to perfectly execute a "string", where all of your oCDs flow near perfectly for optimal DPS. Things like, instead of doing IR -> BOTD, BOTD -> IR is used. BFB and IR are "held" a GCD to remove clipping and placed in positions which benefit other GCDs. Delays before Internal Release and Blood for Blood are calculated, so I can fit in as many oCDs as possible.


What's also interesting is that I'm able to actually get Jump to be buffed by every single BFB application used, granted, BFB is delayed and a Skillspeed of +670 is being used. The 3rd Jump/PS also isn't delayed!

Watch the video carefully from around... 1:10 ^^ (Or just before second BFB application)

Sunnys original analysis of his 900 CRT, 69X SS build is somewhat... True. Unfortunately, the weights do not demonstrate the true nature of Skillspeed as placement of oCDs and buffs are not taken into consideration in the far extreme values of SS/CRT. The weights are based off a static rotation, where X skill is buffed by Y skill at A time in the rotation. Not, "oh I have more SS now so this oCD can be buffed" etc etc. There's more to it than that... But sadly, the spreadsheets or the methodologies being used to calculate the weights can't correctly "weigh" SS dynamically.

I think 1650+ is possible. Some oCDs clipped my GCD and could of been used in more "efficient" places.

As for your second question, I don't know what you're asking. Are you asking for a set-builder? Or wondering how you can get the weights going into 3.2? Or what exactly?

[Ninjah2r]

@MiniTyra

thx for your reply, the new rotation sounds a bit difficult, think I'll wait for dervy's vid whenever that's up XD

And my 2nd question was like, let's say I want to compare weps, how do I calculate which wep is better?

[MiniTyra]

@MiniTyra

thx for your reply, the new rotation sounds a bit difficult, think I'll wait for dervy's vid whenever that's up XD

And my 2nd question was like, let's say I want to compare weps, how do I calculate which wep is better?

Maybe Dervy is haunting the forums.

Anyway, you just multiply the stats by the stat weights per weapon, then add them up.

Weapon with higher weight = better weapon, uusally.

[Ninjah2r]

Maybe Dervy is haunting the forums.

Anyway, you just multiply the stats by the stat weights per weapon, then add them up.

Weapon with higher weight = better weapon, uusally.

alright thanks dear lala

dervy, where are you D:

[Nominous]

(hi!)

The Rotation isn't just the opening burst. Well, sort of is. The opener, I've realised, allows you to perfectly execute a "string", where all of your oCDs flow near perfectly for optimal DPS. Things like, instead of doing IR -> BOTD, BOTD -> IR is used. BFB and IR are "held" a GCD to remove clipping and placed in positions which benefit other GCDs. Delays before Internal Release and Blood for Blood are calculated, so I can fit in as many oCDs as possible.

What's this new opener? Where is everything placed? Or is there a video, perhaps? It sounds like it's a bit more... forgiving when it comes to double weaving.

[JackFross]

What's this new opener? Where is everything placed? Or is there a video, perhaps? It sounds like it's a bit more... forgiving when it comes to double weaving.

It's not really new. It's the same as the one in the opening post, just with BotD and IR having their order swapped.
http://ffxivrotations.com/2qy - This is what he uses in the video.

Through my own theorycrafting a bit after that was mentioned, I found that this is technically higher opening burst.
http://ffxivrotations.com/2qz

The difference is minor/negligible. Important to note is that, with a 2.4 gcd, your Internal Release will pick up the gsk after Vorpal if you do gsk>life in the normal rotation (that is, IR>BotD) but it won't pick it up if you do life>gsk. The reason for Dervy's change is likely to shift Life Surge that second or so sooner to make things smoother in the long run while still maintaining IR buff on the gsk, since gsk is a flexible cooldown. He's doing insane levels of optimization to pull off an ideal rotation for maximum dps. That shift has absolutely no impact on the dps of the opener, but it has effects down the road.

[MiniTyra]

What's this new opener? Where is everything placed? Or is there a video, perhaps? It sounds like it's a bit more... forgiving when it comes to double weaving.

No, it's not more forgiving at all. It's less forgiving as the timing of every single oCD is 95% more strict.

The reason for Dervy's change is likely to shift Life Surge that second or so sooner to make things smoother in the long run while still maintaining IR buff on the gsk, since gsk is a flexible cooldown. He's doing insane levels of optimization to pull off an ideal rotation for maximum dps. That shift has absolutely no impact on the dps of the opener, but it has effects down the road.

Yup. And I also slightly screwed up in that video (double weaved in the wrong order and clipped my GCD twice). I think I could push 1650+ if it weren't for those two GCD clips, something I've since fixed.

As for the double CT opener, that's something myself and Relia have talked about extensively. As he's correctly mentioned, there's only a 700 damage difference between x2 CT and standard CT openers. You can use either; and some fights may actually favour double CT, over the standard GCD opener. One good example as you correctly mentioned is A4S, if you have a very fast (sub 1min) or slow (post-1:20) Leg 1 kill time.

You also switch around IR and BFB. Whilst that is slightly more Potency in the opener, it effectively pushes your BFB in a very tight spot where you're using it before PH. With higher levels of skillspeed which I now run, this will 100% definitely force me to clip my GCD, or end up delaying it by a further GCD, both of which are dramatic DPS losses. If you're running a 600SS set, then putting BFB where you've put it, Jack, is pretty solid, and was a complete oversight by myself.

As for me, personally, I'll stick to using it before ID, as I now rock 690+ SS on all of my gear sets.

[JackFross]

You also switch around IR and BFB. Whilst that is slightly more Potency in the opener, it effectively pushes your BFB in a very tight spot where you're using it before PH. With higher levels of skillspeed which I now run, this will 100% definitely force me to clip my GCD, or end up delaying it by a further GCD, both of which are dramatic DPS losses. If you're running a 600SS set, then putting BFB where you've put it, Jack, is pretty solid, and was a complete oversight by myself.

As for me, personally, I'll stick to using it before ID, as I now rock 690+ SS on all of my gear sets.

Yeah, I run 604 skill speed. The thing for me is that having B4B come back up just after Phlebotomize works out well for me, since the way my Jumps roll, my fourth Jump comes up just after B4B falls off if I use it before Phlebotomize, but just before it falls off if I use it after. In that particular instance, I actually get a gain from having it delayed that additional gcd. Granted, it's likely set up that way because my Jump timings are bad or something (1 after 1st 4th hit; 2 after 2nd Vorpal Thrust; 3 after 4th Heavy Thrust, 4 after 2nd B4B Chaos Thrust) which seems consistent at +3 gcds from the previous one, so I dunno. I did number crunching for it a page or two back. Please correct me if I'm doing something outright wrong here. Trading Phleb for a 4th hit + Jump turned out to be a net gain of B4B potency, in general.