People selling runs, why not talking about it ?

[Werhusky]

That this thread got necroed seriously shocked me o.O

Anyway I never was a fan of runselling but I have a few friends that are into that and I don't mind that at all. Funny enough its two opinions on this matter I openly experience and the result is the same. Those that strictly are "against" and those that practise the selling are those to help me out if a friend or myself need help for clears of friends without payment.
Guess the matter is just if you are willing to pay you find some people taking that offer... like in irl

Been ever since a person to drag people into and through content (beware of my random invites!!) and I totally agree with you FC Lead Alisa180 hope there are more people like him out there

[Preypacer]

@preypacer:

While they are like that, the fact remains that most people only want to be carried. Almost every pf that has a high ilv requirement (way over the necessary) and has an aggressive stance towards errors is made by someone looking for free carries. It's just sad that people don't want to learn.

I used to help out pfs all the time, but this attitude got way too common, and it's made me not help people through there anymore. If someone asks through a linkshell or sends a tell, I will. But it's rare I join pf groups anymore.

Fine. If you don't want to help someone, then don't help them. 'No' is a perfectly viable answer. It's your time and your right.

However, I don't see what that has to do with my situation, as nothing I said falls in line with me just wanting to be carried.

I also don't see what that has to do with the hypocrisy of someone arguing against the idea of content being toned down on the pretense that "it's supposed to be difficult and players should have to work at and defeat it, not be given an easy ride through it!"... when in reality, they don't care about carrying people, so long as it's putting a few more million gil in their wallet, and their only real concern with toning things down is that it might result in fewer people buying clears.

If you're (not you specifically) only interested in selling clears, and there's a market for it.. then by all means. But be honest about your intentions, and don't put up a BS front, pretending that you actually care about whether they're carried through it or earn it on their own.

[PArcher]

You missed the point then. It's a rare player now that actually wants to learn the fights and progress if they aren't in the "first wave" of clearing. In general, waiting shows a lack of care fir the accomplishment, just wanting to get the clear to say they got the clear.

Yes, you are different, but most in your situation are just looking to get carried. And those also happen to be willing to pay for the clear if it's mentioned.

[dekal]

I don't see the problem of people selling clears. What I see wrong is this 1) people that put their service in the market and expect to be able to always have that income or keep it on that price. Demand and supply is everything in life (real or virtual. If people were from another dimension from the rest of us then yeah, someone could debat about it), and 2) people that bought their clears and want to brag how they cleared it. You can brag about all the wasted money you used to be carried, but don't brag about the clear if you didn't learn the mechanics.

[Jpec07]

Technically, if you see someone selling something like content clears, houses, or anything that does not have an initial Gil value, you should report it, because such behavior encourages RMT. It's hard to say exactly where the line should be drawn, but it is up to the GMs to determine what is and is not acceptable.

[Ashkendor]

Technically, if you see someone selling something like content clears, houses, or anything that does not have an initial Gil value, you should report it, because such behavior encourages RMT. It's hard to say exactly where the line should be drawn, but it is up to the GMs to determine what is and is not acceptable.

Let's not start a witch hunt here. Clear runs don't encourage RMT anymore than anything else that people do in exchange for gil. If you wanna start down that road, why not just report everything listed on the market board? High priced crafting goods probably encourage RMT to a much more widespread degree than content clears do, especially now with the relic quest. Let's face it, the majority of the community is way more concerned with glamour and shiny minions than they are with clearing endgame raids, at least to the degree that they're willing to pay for it. I mean hell, the entire housing system encourages RMT; resale is definitely more egregious but when small plots start in the millions a lot of players don't know where to start.

[Starbirth]

If you wanna start down that road, why not just report everything listed on the market board?

The market board sells items, not services. From what I've heard people who sell runs don't even give the items to the buyer and lets be honest that this is evidence of some deep rooted problems within the game.

[SnugglesD]

The market board sells items, not services. From what I've heard people who sell runs don't even give the items to the buyer and lets be honest that this is evidence of some deep rooted problems within the game.

First, your third hand knowledge is wrong. Its expected to give the buyer the loot when you sell a clear. Some d-bags will have separate price schedules for clears with/without loot, but its not common. The only time you'll really see a lootless clear is when you buy it from a group that's loot locked for the week.

Second, there's absolutely nothing wrong with charging for services. What's wrong is expecting others to do something for you for free just because you want it. There is absolutely nothing in the ToS about selling services for in game currency.

[Kuwagami]

There is absolutely nothing in the ToS about selling services for in game currency.

It's in a somewhat grey area as it definitively encourages RMT at some point, but the general rule of thumb is "sellers are to be careful as to who they pick as buyers". If you end up with RMT gils, they'll be removed and that's it. The only run sellers I've ever heard being banned were actively overpricing their runs and accepted hundreds of millions of gils from shadowy characters. Idiots, in short.

[Andrea]

Second, there's absolutely nothing wrong with charging for services. What's wrong is expecting others to do something for you for free just because you want it. There is absolutely nothing in the ToS about selling services for in game currency.

This. They are offering to sell a service to clear content for you 100%. If you don't like it you are free to do it in a way that doesn't cost money.