Please don't gate scrips behind folklore gathering items in 3.2.

[Duuude007]

I think you're confused. ... I'm talking about the need of gathering tokens (ooids) in order to buy crafting mats.

Dont want to farm materials? Don't buy crafting mats then... just buy the unsocketed finished gear. It only requires crafting red scrips.

You want to craft the meldable gear, earn the materials like everybody else. Its easy.

[Ranzan]

Dont want to farm materials? Don't buy crafting mats then... just buy the unsocketed finished gear. It only requires crafting red scrips.

You want to craft the meldable gear, earn the materials like everybody else. Its easy.

Or have the new mats only require crafting scrips instead of gathering and crafting scrips. Next patch they said the new crafted gear (DoW/W) will be up there with tome gear so one would think it shouldn't be as time consuming to gather mats to craft stuff to sell. (Cap gathering AND crafting scrips and then gather mats to craft 4+ hour process)

Back on topic. I agree because specialist items are not buyer friendly cause of the micro monopolies that are going on. Most people would be put of by gear costing 600k cause said seller has next to no competition. Since tome gear is still more efficient to the average player these items may as well be D.O.A.

[Mindy_Macready]

Dont want to farm materials? Don't buy crafting mats then... just buy the unsocketed finished gear. It only requires crafting red scrips.

You want to craft the meldable gear, earn the materials like everybody else. Its easy.

Nobody said anything about not wanting to farm materials. What I'm saying is crafters should be able to farm for red scrip crafting materials without having to use gathering token items like Ooids, because DoW/DoM classes never needed tokens like Ooids to spend their tomes on crafting mats.

Simple concept, yet it seems to elude you in your responses.

[Seyb]

I agree that the current scrip system and how to get the ilvl 170 crafting gear is very tedious. On the other hand, if this gear stays the strongest gear up until patch 3.4 or even until the new expansion, then the effort is well worth it.

How could they introduce a new coloured scrip? They can't just replace the blue scrips with the red ones and introduce yellow scrips or whatever. How would you earn the new scrips? By crafting and delivering 1 or 2 star gear? Another big gil sink. What would you get from them? New gear that's way stronger than the current gear? This just doesn't make much sense to me.

I think the new crafted gear for DOW/DOM in patch 3.2 will be similar to the current ilvl 185 gear. It might be ilvl 215, specialist only and require 2 star gathered folklore mats (why else did we gear up our gatherers), but I don't mind. As long as we can produce that gear just as easily as the skypirate's gear, everything's okay.

[Ibi]

if this gear stays the strongest gear up until patch 3.4 or even until the new expansion, then the effort is well worth it.

The problem being that it's currently a gamble to assume that that will happen. Probably a safe gamble, but a gamble none-the-less. It depends on just how similar to tomestones they really intend for the scrips system to be. If their design intent was for them to be completely analogous, they'd be adding a full set of new items with 3.2 (and again in 3.4).

I don't really think they will (primarily because DoH/DoL also spend a ton of gil overmelding their gear) but, given the other design decisions they've made for 3.x, I'm not going to say it's an impossibility.

How could they introduce a new coloured scrip? They can't just replace the blue scrips with the red ones and introduce yellow scrips or whatever.

Why not? They've done it with tomestones. Radz-at-Han Quenching Oil was originally purchased with tomestones of philosophy. Each time a tomestone was phased out, it was made available for the next tomestone, at a reduced cost. In the same way, they could make the blue scrip items available for a lower number of red scrips and make the collectables that currently turn in for blue scrips turn in for a smaller amount of red scrips.

How would you earn the new scrips? By crafting and delivering 1 or 2 star gear? Another big gil sink.

Or they could just add new recipes, specifically catered to the new scrips. Everything about 3.x crafting has been designed to eat up gil, from recipes requiring more raw materials to the decreased rate of good/excellent procs.

What would you get from them? New gear that's way stronger than the current gear? This just doesn't make much sense to me.

Yep, exactly the same way it currently works with tomestones.

DoW/DoM already replace the entirety of their gear every even patch. The costs are pretty comparable if you look at the i180 DoH/DoL gear (4,125 tomestones of esoterics for main hand, hand, body, hands, legs, and feet, compared to 4,000 red scrips for the in the same slots), but you can cap red scrips in a lot less time than it takes to cap esoterics.

I think the new crafted gear for DOW/DOM in patch 3.2 will be similar to the current ilvl 185 gear. It might be ilvl 215, specialist only and require 2 star gathered folklore mats (why else did we gear up our gatherers), but I don't mind. As long as we can produce that gear just as easily as the skypirate's gear, everything's okay.

The new crafted gear for DoW/DoM is supposed to actually be a viable alternative to tomestone (and possibly also raid dropped) gear.

Given that SE said they had to make the relic quest extremely time consuming in order to have it be suitably balanced with raid gear, it's likely that the new crafted gear will also involve heavy time and/or gil investments.

[Seyb]

While I see your points, Ibi, (and I share the same apprehensions) my hope is that S-E sees that DOM/DOW and DOH/DOL are completely different and cannot be handled the same way.

And since the acquisition of our beloved ilvl170 gear is already as time consuming as the relic (or just a million times more expensive), I think the gate for the new crafted DOM/DOW gear is already given. No need for another gate. Just have the stats requirements for 3 star be around 850 crafts and control.

[keyburz]

Nobody said anything about not wanting to farm materials. What I'm saying is crafters should be able to farm for red scrip crafting materials without having to use gathering token items like Ooids, because DoW/DoM classes never needed tokens like Ooids to spend their tomes on crafting mats.

Tell us, what would you suggest be the method to obtain them? Would you have purified coke for example, just be mined from an unspoiled node? Because that would be way too much for the market. The system last time with 4 star materials was from farming coil which worked great, but it left gatherer's in the dark. And if you take out the requirement of gatherers needed to provide the ooids/plants, and just let crafters turn in scrips directly for mats, then you now have 2 classes even further separated from eachother. If you take out crafter's tokens being required, then you have no use for the crafter's tokens once you are finished gearing up with them (if you even do so)

[Duuude007]

Simple concept, yet it seems to elude you in your responses.

Except what seems to elude you is the very basic concept of supply and demand.

You can make whatever you want, with almost no exceptions, without picking up a DoL tool.

This is true for the red scrip gear as well.

If its too pricy to pay for someone else's work, then you will need to adjust your strategy.

No craftable gear can be made without materials- SOMEONE must earn them. I gather them, as do many others. Some buy them with gil to avoid gathering, or farm law/seals to earn materials... or trade crafting services for mats. What makes you think you actually deserve materials that do not require some form of basic "earn your keep" contract with either a player or existing game mechanics?

If you don't want to do the work to earn materials via DoL, earn the keep gear instead. We aren't going to support the concept that you should get materials without some form of exertion, lol.

[Mindy_Macready]

Except what seems to elude you is the very basic concept of supply and demand.

You can make whatever you want, with almost no exceptions, without picking up a DoL tool.

This is true for the red scrip gear as well.

If its too pricy to pay for someone else's work, then you will need to adjust your strategy.

No craftable gear can be made without materials- SOMEONE must earn them. I gather them, as do many others. Some buy them with gil to avoid gathering, or farm law/seals to earn materials... or trade crafting services for mats. What makes you think you actually deserve materials that do not require some form of basic "earn your keep" contract with either a player or existing game mechanics?

If you don't want to do the work to earn materials via DoL, earn the keep gear instead. We aren't going to support the concept that you should get materials without some form of exertion, lol.

Whoooooooooooosh.

[Duuude007]

Whoooooooooooosh.

Impressive counterargument. Keep it classy.