The arrogance of some people

[Odett]

I like how people come here to post "oh look, this thread again" as if they're being made to read through it and simply can't ignore it if it doesn't hold any interest to them. It's no surprise that this subject (among many others like parser use and STR tanks) keeps being brought up again and again, because it's obviously something important that's worth talking about.

It's not even about different playstyles, it's a fact that there are many moments in fights where healing does not need to be done (provided the tank and dps aren't made of tracing paper and know how to dodge, because there ARE times when you have to be the babysitter of the group) and standing there doing absolutely nothing or appearing to look useful by overhealing the tank with a cure whenever they drop below 100% HP is absolutely worthless and a disservice to the other people you're playing with. You can't full-time heal in this game simply because that is not how this game was designed.

Stop locking yourself on your role and say to yourself "I'm not gonna do this because I am ___ role, even if I have the ability to do so". A SMN refusing to use Raise when healers can't is crappy, a NIN refusing to use Goad, Shadewalker, or Smokescreen, is crappy. A properly-geared tank who spams the agro combo is crappy. A BRD refusing to sing is crappy. A healer who refuses to help DPS provided that there is downtime is crappy.

[Ashkendor]

...There's good points being made? All I've seen over these 40 pages is that people classed as DPS don't know how to dps apparently, even in savage and need to be carried by healers.

You realize there's a point at which DPS are performing optimally and actually physically can't do more damage with the gear they currently have, right? If you aren't clearing at that point, you can either wait till you get more gear or find the damage elsewhere.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

blah

We go "this again" because it's just another topic that does nothing but go in circles and people think THIS time will be the one people will "see the truth", despite the same old stories posted time and time again. I wouldn't be surprised if people just copypasta their previous replies just to save time. People are more stubborn than a wall no matter which side of the fence you're on. /thread.

[RuleofThree]

Ninjas have to also manage others threat and TP, while keeping up our own dots, and debuffs. With ahealers argument, that's completely optional.. so why should I bother anymore?

I can't find the post. Anyway someone made a post about how a 'good' healer can drop roughly 1,000dps on a group of trash mobs, and roughly 600dps on a boss. There are tanks that can drop some heavy dps as well. In this post, it was stated (This isn't exact quote, I apologize) "If you have a healer and tank that dps, it's basically like having another compitent dps." Really, numerous other posts spit out numbers and go about stating this same thing, just less poinent than the one I am referencing.

So...I'm not being salty...I have read other posts....According to most of you, Tank dps + Healer dps = another dps in party. Logically, this means we don't need one dps in a party. Dorander....we dont' need you man, you want us to do your job, that means you don't have to.

[PenelopeWinn]

I'll never understand the whole, "Well, they're not doing their best, so why should I?". It's a horrid way to play an MMO and an even worse attitude for real life.

[Tilgung]

No, it means we want to clear dungeons even faster because we've seen them 327058275279 times. Even shaving 2 minutes off of what would've been a 20 minute dungeon is a 10% speed increase. Shaving off 5 is a 25% speed increase.

[SlyTribal]

So...I'm not being salty...I have read other posts....According to most of you, Tank dps + Healer dps = another dps in party. Logically, this means we don't need one dps in a party. Dorander....we dont' need you man, you want us to do your job, that means you don't have to.

This just sounds like you're complaining about things being done faster and more efficiently. Yet again, not a single person here asking for Healer's to DPS is telling them to BE a DPS, just to contribute with their DPS spells while they don't need to heal/buff. Healers do get enough down time for this.

[Odett]

So...I'm not being salty...I have read other posts....According to most of you, Tank dps + Healer dps = another dps in party. Logically, this means we don't need one dps in a party. Dorander....we dont' need you man, you want us to do your job, that means you don't have to.

Your response would only make sense if there was a cap on group DPS.

[Odett]

We go "this again" because it's just another topic that does nothing but go in circles and people think THIS time will be the one people will "see the truth", despite the same old stories posted time and time again. I wouldn't be surprised if people just copypasta their previous replies just to save time. People are more stubborn than a wall no matter which side of the fence you're on. /thread.

yeah sorry it's gonna keep going

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

You realize there's a point at which DPS are performing optimally and actually physically can't do more damage with the gear they currently have, right? If you aren't clearing at that point, you can either wait till you get more gear or find the damage elsewhere.

I suppose that is true, so ignore my comment on savage. It still holds true that healers are expected to carry bad*DPS in non savage content though. There's already several posts in this very thread that basically say, from the healers that DPS at every opportunity, "Go ahead and be bad DPS, we'll carry you", though, which is what I take issue with.