The arrogance of some people

[Kaurie]

Not when people die, sorry, no it's not efficient. Heal first, keep the party safe (and that doesn't mean keeping them on the brink of death), then worry about dps'ing. Pretty simple actually.

Letting a tank get to 20% =/= Death. Just to clarify, dying happens at 0%.

i think you all are just want to feel better by pointing to the healer who doesn't dps and say: "i am better than you! i am better than average!" >.</

i think that's the real reason these kind of topics pop up every once a week and repeat over and over and over again over 37 pages now...

Actually my FC mate was kicked for DPSing in a dungeon as a SCH (no one died or anything). It seems that people are very strongly for it and strongly against it with fewer people in the middle.

[LaylaTsarra]

Letting a tank get to 20% =/= Death. Just to clarify, dying happens at 0%.

Oh they do at 0%, I think we all know that, now don't we. Being smart about the fact that some healers do over dps and create issues where wipes happen is real. You do get that right?

[Kaurie]

Oh they do at 0%, I think we all know that, now don't we. Being smart about the fact that some healers do over dps and create issues where wipes happen is real. You do get that right?

I am simply saying that letting a tank drop to 20% is efficient. Some healers are bad at it, true. Just like some DPS are bad at their rotations, it doesn't mean that doing a rotation is bad.

Letting a tank drop more helps reduce the amount of stance dancing you have to do, resulting in less time wasted. It also results in less overheal % which is an efficient use of MP and GCDs.

I'd like to add, that generally you can see how fast the tanks HP is dropping - if you've casted 1 GCD of DPS and the tank is at 60%, then swap back because they are losing 40% per GCD. You really need to gauge it. As a WHM you can help the situation by throwing swiftcast Holy (stun), or a SCH by throwing down swiftcast Shadowflare (slow).

[Tint]

Actually my FC mate was kicked for DPSing in a dungeon as a SCH (no one died or anything). It seems that people are very strongly for it and strongly against it with fewer people in the middle.

yeah, but the people who are for dpsing are very loud >.>

i don't like dpsing as a healer, but i know i should. and because of the loud people i am trying tanking now. i was a really good healer, on the healing side, not dpsing xD but it's no fun anymore to hear all the time healers who don't dps are lazy and bad and stuff.... so, i am now a really bad tank instead of a good healer, but at least i am attacking the monsters now ^^/

[KaitlanKela]

Oh they do at 0%, I think we all know that, now don't we. Being smart about the fact that some healers do over dps and create issues where wipes happen is real. You do get that right?

So because some people aren't capable of contributing to the group effort in more than one capacity we should just lower the bar for everyone at great cost to efficiency?

I mean, since I'm leveling a tank now I get healers who only heal all the time. Makes me sad since I main a healer and I know what their potential is, but I just smh and move on. You can't expect greatness from everyone. At the same time, why on earth would you say that the bare minimum is all that's required?

ETA, if the tank dying because you mis-gauged your DPS as a healer causes a wipe you can't recover from...did you get swiftcast?

[Kaurie]

yeah, but the people who are for dpsing are very loud >.>

i don't like dpsing as a healer, but i know i should. and because of the loud people i am trying tanking now. i was a really good healer, on the healing side, not dpsing xD but it's no fun anymore to hear all the time healers who don't dps are lazy and bad and stuff.... so, i am now a really bad tank instead of a good healer, but at least i am attacking the monsters now ^^/

Could be. I've yet to be in a dungeon that either has someone yell at a healer for not DPSing or for kicking a healer who does DPS. I've only read about it. As someone who mained SCH in 2.x and played SCH/WHM a lot in 3.x, I've DPSd in every dungeon/raid that I've been in. So when I am on my SMN and see the healer is not DPSing, I just roll my eyes and move on. It's no different to me than a crappy DPS who stands in AoEs or does half the damage they should be.

[Eothas]

When I'm tanking I feel really bad when the healer keep me at 100% HP at all times, It feels like I'm doing so bad that I need a babysitter all times, I feel like trash. Meanwhile when I see that the healer is able to DPS and keep me alive, even if I go under 20%, I feel confident, then I know that I'm doing a good job mitigating damage.

But that's just me.

[Odett]

I've experienced some healers where the HP for the tank gets closer to 20 percent and playing as a dps one is lucky when you can actually catch a heal from some of them. That type of healer just doesn't quite get their role is healing first and dps'ing second.

No, not at all. If no one is dying, then they are doing their job fine DPSing and healing. Keeping people unnecessarily topped off when they don't need to be topped off is useless. If you're playing a tank correctly, it's great if your healer let's you fall under 50%, especially WAR, since you get to put skills like Equillibrium to good use. I can't count the number of times I don't even touch Equillibrium because my DF healer can't let themselves see me under 90% HP. If you're mitigating correctly, and no tank buster is coming, there is absolutely no need for your healer to constantly keep you higher than 50% HP.

[MeiUshu]

@Odett

In DF though, people dont know you, letting a tank dropping below 50% WITHOUT knowing that person or having already run with that person, is taking the risk to see him die in no time just because you THOUGHT he was capable of holding his own. In DF I prefer by far not allowing him to fall below 70% then taking the risk to see him die because of me overestimating his capacities and being kicked for not Healing right. This is the chances you take in DF....healers have been too often yelled at for allowing health to drop down below 60% and I personally dont allow that anymore, at least not in DF with unknown.

[KaitlanKela]

When I go in with an "unknown" tank, I play how I always play: giving my best effort and not holding anything back. If you're a receptive healer to your tank this is totally not a problem and not a hard thing to do. It's easy to adjust for a sub-par tank. I've never been yelled at for it, even in DF. I have only ever gotten yelled at in DF if I seriously f'd up and I know it.