Lets shut these new tanks up please: 7 PLD 1 SCH Thordan clear and then 7 DrK 1 WHM

[FrejyaAthenes]

Give vids plz. Soo wanna see this.

Pretty sure that's the point. Wouldn't do much good to shout "We did it" without proof.

[kensatsu]

war in delivrance can't use equilibrum to heal himself, so they can use other self heal but not the better one

OT wars don't take a lot of damage, they aren't dps

so healing them is easy, the whm just have to do medica II and other time Medica I, to get all the OT alive, it's so easy the Main tank is almost all the time with Medica II and regen stacked on him, so he just have to Cure/Cure II when the main tank get a cleave.

Reynhart : , whay freyy said when you play war you can do storm path, butcher block or storm eye; butcher block, later when you get more aggro you can do storm path/storm eyes sometimes if you want, with your pld you can do the 3 combo in a raw without loose time for refreshing your dot. with the war you can't do storm path/storm eye/butcher block without loose some second for the two debuff.
Also when a war can swap easy dps /tank stance, when a war swap is in delivrance this war sacrifing Tank utility like inner beast to dps more, when a PLD swap in sword oath you get rid or shield oat but still can use all the pld skill. and he never say others tank don't make choice.
But we can tell war is designed to make the choose to only focusing dps or tanking by choice because you take rid of migitation to dps more and vice versa, but dark can do this as well depend on what you choose to use dark art

[Reynhart]

Also when a war can swap easy dps /tank stance, when a war swap is in delivrance this war sacrifing Tank utility like inner beast to dps more, when a PLD swap in sword oath you get rid or shield oat but still can use all the pld skill. and he never say others tank don't make choice.

When a WAR changes stance, it keeps all of its stacks, and doesn't interrupt anything. He also doesn't take more damage, meaning that putting back Defiance after the hits still gives you most of its benefit.
When a PLD changes stance, he lose one GCD, dealying its next combo. Thus, he has to plan carefully (In fact, more than WAR) how many GCD he can stay in Sword Oath to make it meaningful, while also reactivating Shield Oath before the next big hit. In fact, he will suffer far more than WAR by being in the wrong stance.

Considering that, you can go in two directions.
1) PLD is not supposed to stance dance, which contradicts how the game is designed now.
2) In its design, PLD put much more emphasis on planning carrefully your actions because screwing will be much less forgiving, thus claiming that WAR is THE tank where you have to make careful choices is far from the truth.

WAR is also the only tank having a skill to negates its damage penalty and skills that natively ignores damage penalty, thus keeping its mitigation AND damage at the same time.

[MagiusNecros]

I have a question though. If PLD and DRK must use MP to activate their stances, why doesn't Warrior use TP to switch between their own? Honest question here.

[Reynhart]

I have a question though. If PLD and DRK must use MP to activate their stances, why doesn't Warrior use TP to switch between their own? Honest question here.

Because they "use" recast.
Before DRK every skill only had one "cost" : MP, TP or recast.

[MagiusNecros]

Because they "use" recast.
Before DRK every skill only had one "cost" : MP, TP or recast.

Seems odd that a Drk's Grit and both of Pld's Oath's are both on the GCD while a WAR's are just on a recast time, a recast time that could have easily been as long as it takes to refund an amount of TP used to switch stances. And off GCD to boot. Not to mention Equilibrium in Deliverance refunds TP cost to begin with.

Odd design choice. Quite the similarity for both tanks designed toward the MT role. While it likely defines WAR as the definitive OT role.

[kensatsu]

it's not what we said, but ok War is OP blah blah keep doing your crying.
it's not like we said you don't have to make choice as pld, learn to read...
we already all know pld can't swap like they want... ect because it a cost of GCD, and you need to be more carefull... and swap again in time before getting hit.
I never use equilibirum to refund tp, i don't need it exept in A2S because of a overpower abuse. cause It's not needed.
You can realy go with your 7 dark or 7 pld to run thordan to see you can beat it also...

[Xenosan]

Oaths and Grit are Spells, Defiance/Deliverance are Abilities.

Abilities have no cost.

Look at the recent change to Shield Swipe. It was a Weaponskill (TP cost), now it's just an Ability (free).

That's the three categories FAIK. Spells MP, Abilities, and Weaponskills TP.

Abilities usually have no cost save for recast timer (and like Energy Drain, Inner Beast, etc they may require a resource mechanic like stacks or BotD buff)

If Defiance/Deliverance were to use TP as a cost resource, than they'd have to be changed to Weaponskills.

edit: and are there even any OGCD Weaponskills in the game? Bard? Not in game to check.. Pretty sure all the OGCDs are either Abilities (leg sweep, brutal swing, swipe, reprisal[?], Spirits [?] CoS [?]) or spells (salted earth, dark passenger)

[Isius]

snip

No, Warrior's mitigation, dmg intake, always stays the same in both stances. You don't instantly migitated more dmg like a pld/drk with it's -20% dmg reduction. Warrior's gain more HP, and increase healing received. Warrior is a HP sponge tank, it always gets hits for the same amount in Deliverance, or in Defiance. You say other tanks can still use all of thier def cds, while you lose yours, okay? Here are your other tank def utilities as a Warrior. You still have Vengence, Raw Intuition, Blood Bath, Foresight, Convalesence, Thrill of Battle, Awareness, Holmgang, Second Wind, Storm's Path, Feather Foot, and Mantra def cds as ways to tank dmg better on a Warrior in either stance. I will even say Berzerk, Unchained, and Internal Release are defensive cds for Warrior, since they increase the output of Blood Bath, Second Wind, HP regen in either stance, and Equilibrium while in Defiance. Fell Cleave can be treated as a def cd, when paired with Bloodbath while in Deliverance, and better if paired up with Berzerk/Internal Release, and again with Bloodbath also works with Maim, Storm's Eye, and Vengence to regen more HP. You can get a ton of HP regen on either stance with Bloodbath, and all these def cds I mention are on short cds, normally 2mins or less, so you never really run out of def cds as a Warrior, unless you stack cds like crazy.

Don't treat Warrior as something special, and loses more between it's stances versus the other tanks, and if it was really a choice for Warrior to be in tank/dps stance, and to say the other tanks do it as well, or keep more between stances. Because it is not the same. The only time you should stay in Defiance all the time is to get aggro, or while in progress till you learn the fight, just like any other tank should do. Because learning the mechanics, and progressing more into a encounter to learn it is far more important, then any tank dying in the first couple of minutes, because we got to always have man mode up all the time, but afterwards when you know the fight you will mostly just stay in Deliverance, because you know the encounter, and now know where the high dmg is coming from, and only pop in and out of Defiance when needed. After that back to Deliverance.

Don't say you lose more tanking-wise as Warrior between your tank/dps stance versus the other tanks as if it was a big deal. You have as much or more mitigation tools on a Warrior as the other tanks in dps stance, if you know how to use your kit well. What you gain/lose between stances are Defiance- Innerbeast, Steel Cyclone, Equilbruim Heal / Deliverance-Fell Cleave, Decimate, Equilbruim TP regen. Which you can swap stances every 10 secs during high dmg periods, with no real cons, while upfront the other tanks eat 1 gcd, mp cost, combo interruption going into tank stance. So saying Warrior skills are locked behind stances is really a moot point.

Warrior is a very well built class why people are saying it is OVERPOWERED. It's offense can be used as it's defense, and it's defense can be used as offense. Warrior's whole kit basically synergies very well with one another defensively, and offensively. THERE REALLY IS NO MAJOR NEGATIVE SIDE AFFECTS AS WARRIOR, AND FOR THE ONES IT DOES HAVE ARE ONLY SLIGHT NEGATIVES. WARRIOR OFFERS FAR MORE FREEDOM OF CHOICE, AND LESS DRAWBACKS AS A TANK VERSUS THE OTHER TANKS.

[Freyyy]

Abilities have no cost.

edit: and are there even any OGCD Weaponskills in the game? Bard? Not in game to check.. Pretty sure all the OGCDs are either Abilities (leg sweep, brutal swing, swipe, reprisal[?], Spirits [?] CoS [?]) or spells (salted earth, dark passenger)

Empyreal Arrow from BRD is an oGCD weaponskill that costs TP. Salted Earth is an ability as well as Dark Passenger as shown above.