Savage Clear rate being lower the Devs expected, good or a bad thing?

[Mature]

I have zero interest doing savage. I might join the odd pf requesting to go in to try it. But apart from that I'm not really bothered.

Yoship mentioned that is clears are lower than expected. Well there's a hell load of hard-core players out there like myself without static , and I mean a lot of us.

And it's not usually that savage is difficult is the fact that you just can't get people together with the same level of interest to do it.

I'm glad savage is an optional raid without mqs gated.

[Kuwagami]

It also taught us that the majority of the hardcore aren't as hardcore as they like to think! It's a shame as Wildstar is a fairly decent game.

And if LOTRA taught us anything, forsaking the hardcore causes your game to become a joke and die. There is a happy medium, but no one is really interested in finding that.

heh. They did coil. They did savage. They did story mode.

The first was sorta good (around 10-15% clear rate at the end of a cycle) for the mid-core crowd. Ultra-hardcore (but in reality, mostly harcore wannabes) complain that it's too easy.

The second was utter failure. Because at the time it didn't give any incentive. People tried it but meh, gotta get the loot. Alexander Savage forced the mode on us, and we can all see the result now. Deserted raiding scene.

The last one however was a huge success. It raised other problems (lack of incentives to do higher difficulties because the story and bosses are exactly the same) but they can be solved by some minor changes (delay easy mode by half a patch or a full patch, to let people do the "hard" mode first and then go to normal if they can't make it and want to see the story. + bonus catch up gear.) Though, with 50% of the playerbase clearing it, it showed that the community as a whole want AND can do raid, arguably harder than the classic trials.


Let's hope that these experiments can lead to a happy medium.

[Zenji]

It's all because of the enrages, imo. They are poorly designed.

Heck the A1S enrage happens mid-mechanic. I still don't know who thought that was a good idea.

Have your tanks grab the last set of adds, bait the puddle, burn down boss. Easy solution.

[SuperZay]

Leaving a majority of raid population with only A1S and A2S for the whole season was a bad thing which resulted in a lot of lost subs because people got bored/gave up on A3S.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Perhaps I haven't played enough of the latter content, however I am just not seeing this supposed disregard for old dungeons. Despite playing a DPS, my queues for any of the pre-50 dungeons have been relatively fast, depending on the hour. All hard mode primals have popped surprisingly fast. In fact, I've run Titan HM some 20+ times and only waited 20ish minutes when it was 6am EST. The one exception has been Garuda EX. So people are seemingly still running old content.

[RussW]

SE decided if they wanted to have a relevant MMO they needed ultra hardcore raiding in the form of overtuned bosses and undergeared players. They are still pushing this going forward into 3.1 but instead of adjusting content they are soft nerfing it by adding better gear in a bunch of other locations.

The idea behind progression "raiding" is that the first boss gives you drops to beat the second boss which gives you drops to beat the third boss which gives you drops to beat the fourth boss which in this case would then give trophy items like mounts and weapons so you can stand around in town and show off your epeens.

In this case the first boss was fractal / neverreap and a vendor in Idyllshire therefore everybody thought they were ready to go into savage when they were in fact not ready.

This whole scenario is simply bad game design. I have no doubt that SE will probably not learn from their mistakes. Im pretty sure they think their playerbase is made up of people who want to sit in housing and wear bunny ears or talk about lore instead of downing bosses on level 60 characters.

[Alkimi]

It's all because of the enrages, imo. They are poorly designed.

Heck the A1S enrage happens mid-mechanic. I still don't know who thought that was a good idea.

The hard enrage on A3S doesn't even need to be there to be honest. The fight is difficult enough mechanically and has enough dps checks within the encounter itself (hands of pain, adds phase, healer kidnap thing) that a soft enrage like a stacking buff or even no enrage at all would have been absolutely fine.

[Giantbane]

It's fine as is. FF Series has always had very difficult trials that most people wont beat. There's lots of challenges that are meant to be beat throughout the rest of the game. It's nice to have additional "impossible" content for those who want a challenge.

Besides, Savage mostly reuses all of the expensive art, programming and sound assets from Normal mode. The extra development cost for Savage is worthwhile.

[Saccharin]

ItFF Series has always had very difficult trials that most people wont beat

I assume this is FF11.

These days it's just not a good business case to make content that a few percent of the player base will ever play; raids are expensive to develop, hence why we got story mode. By the time people have enough gear to clear it easily then it's obsolete.

[Giantbane]

I assume this is FF11.

These days it's just not a good business case to make content that a few percent of the player base will ever play; raids are expensive to develop, hence why we got story mode. By the time people have enough gear to clear it easily then it's obsolete.

Most major final fantasies had some degree of the optional superboss. And if it wasn't in the base game, something was usually added in one of the remakes:

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Superboss


But you're right about story mode. Most of the cost of developing the raid should go into the story mode, like I said. Everybody gets to experience that, so it's all good. Savage mode works well because it reuses most of the story mode raid content. This gives that extra hard core content that only a few % will complete, but at a fraction of the normal cost.

This seems like a good setup to me.