Savage Clear rate being lower the Devs expected, good or a bad thing?

[Kallera]

May I ask why -one- raid/dungeon in this game has to cater specifically to the casual market? Why shouldn't there be content for the best of the best? The 1% excuse is not viable. With that logic, no MMO's should have really hard end game raids.

It is kinda hard justifying development if said content isn't even touched by the majority of the playerbase. A dungeon truly designed so that only the top 1% would attempt to clear it would probably be seen as a waste of time and effort. This game isn't designed for just the 1% to do. That's why the devs design fights around what percentages of players are willing to clear it by x amount of time. If people aren't even interested to play it, or are leaving because of it, what's the point of giving the playerbase more of what doesn't appeal to them?

[Nektulos-Tuor]

It is kinda hard justifying development if said content isn't even touched by the majority of the playerbase. That's why the devs design fights around what percentages of players are willing to clear it. If people aren't even interested to play it, or are leaving because of it, what's the point of giving the playerbase more of what doesn't appeal to them?

I don't like content like "Coils" so I pretty much on a few accounts just avoided it. Its just not fun content.

It matches well with the 0.12% score.

[zosia]

May I ask why -one- raid/dungeon in this game has to cater specifically to the casual market? Why shouldn't there be content for the best of the best? The 1% excuse is not viable. With that logic, no MMO's should have really hard end game raids.

So, Coil was casual content? What does that make alex normal? Mega casual content? I am not arguing for no challenge what so ever, I am simply being practical.

You have three difficulties we can reference:

Easy - alex N - for casuals
Normal - what coil was before echo - for general raiders
Hard - savage coil/alex - for raiding elite.

If we can only have two, why would you want to give the general raiding population the short end of the stick? SE is obviously going to have some easy version for the casual crowd leaving us a choice between normal and hard. If giving the general raiding population, that 10% of the population that cleared coil without echo, a raid they can complete in a reasonable amount of time, then I am all for giving the raiding elite the short end of the stick. I would also count myself as part of that sub 1%, but I don't want to spend another three months working on just four bosses. It was not fun, at all.

[Underlord]

Also I think besides issues like many posted with their own statics, and maintaining them. There's people who would like to try savage, but those statics looking for people want people with experience or progressed so far. Leaving the inexperienced who wanna try it, out. Very very rare do I see a learning group, and when u join one in PF, it's usually a one shot then most leave. Or people who Aren't ready join in anyway, making it harder for others.

[Velhart]

If we can only have two, why would you want to give the general raiding population, the short end of the stick? S

Because a thing called echo buff exists. If you can't beat it now, wait till then with more gear and beat it later. If I recall, the only thing holding most people back from doing SCoB(Savage) was lack of rewards. Raiding is never going to appeal to a large audience no matter how well balanced it is unless you make it stupid easy like it is right now. If what you are seriously asking for in difficulty is Too Easy > Mode that can be beaten by most groups before the odd number patch hits, then I think our conversation is done.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

Because a thing called echo buff exists. If you can't beat it now, wait till then with more gear and beat it later. If I recall, the only thing holding most people back from doing SCoB(Savage) was lack of rewards. Raiding is never going to appeal to a large audience no matter how well balanced it is unless you make it stupid easy like it is right now. If what you are seriously asking for in difficulty is Too Easy > Mode that can be beaten by most groups before the odd number patch hits, then I think our conversation is done.

Well, I'm never gonna throw my face at content that rewards pennies more then easy content.

[RiceisNice]

So, Coil was casual content? What does that make alex normal? Mega casual content? I am not arguing for no challenge what so ever, I am simply being practical.

Coil when it has echo and is considered old content is more oriented to casuals. IMO, that's better than nerfing a content that's designed to be hard (IE, savage), which kind of goes against it's entire premise, assuming that SE wanted savage to be difficult and that only the most dedicated can clear it in the first place.

[zosia]

Because a thing called echo buff exists. If you can't beat it now, wait till then with more gear and beat it later. If I recall, the only thing holding most people back from doing SCoB(Savage) was lack of rewards. Raiding is never going to appeal to a large audience no matter how well balanced it is unless you make it stupid easy like it is right now. If what you are seriously asking for in difficulty is Too Easy > Mode that can be beaten by most groups before the odd number patch hits, then I think our conversation is done.

So, then what is a better solution? The current meta will destroy this game's raiding community so something has to change. It really does not matter, they said they will not be using the same difficulty division for 3.2. We are probably going to get normal coil difficulty level back. So, you're right, our conversation is done.

Coil when it has echo and is considered old content is more oriented to casuals. IMO, that's better than nerfing a content that's designed to be hard (IE, savage), which kind of goes against it's entire premise, assuming that SE wanted savage to be difficult and that only the most dedicated can clear it in the first place.

I don't understand the distinction you are making, if you agree, disagree or are just commenting. I think coil without the echo was geared towards the general raiding population. I agree coil with echo was more for the casual crowd and that nerfing savage alex or SCOB seems to directly contradict the idea of savage.

[Alexftw]

It is kinda hard justifying development if said content isn't even touched by the majority of the playerbase. A dungeon truly designed so that only the top 1% would attempt to clear it would probably be seen as a waste of time and effort. This game isn't designed for just the 1% to do. That's why the devs design fights around what percentages of players are willing to clear it by x amount of time. If people aren't even interested to play it, or are leaving because of it, what's the point of giving the playerbase more of what doesn't appeal to them?

1% being able to clear != 1% attempting it.

How many games do you play and don't finish .

Also if if was too easy people would simply do it and be done and never repeat it after gearing up. Instead this forces people to become better players.

[Mandze]

Most of the people I knew who ran Coil have stopped raiding now, and many of them have left the game entirely. Normal Alex is a face-roll. Savage is boring up until A3S, and then A3S is a months-long face bashing to get absolutely nothing worthwhile-- the gear all looks the same, we've already seen the cutscenes on day one in Alex Normal, and fights aren't even fun. I guess that's a good thing if SE wanted to kill raiding for the majority of people who ran and enjoyed Coil.