On inventory and storage management. [DEVS please take notice.]

[Colorful]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...stion-is-over-!

They outright said no to a glamour log, saying it takes just as much inventory space even though plenty of other games can do it. c:

[AltanRapsied]

They outright said no to a glamour log, saying it takes just as much inventory space even though plenty of other games can do it.

That's why I keep upping it, 'cause if others games can do it and not FFXIV team, this means they don't try to do it. Or at least not enough.
I want proof that they really tried to do it, and a real and big explanation of why they can't. "It's not possible" and "PS3 limitation" are not valuable arg to me.

[Gunspec]

I want proof that they really tried to do it, and a real and big explanation of why they can't.

Your idea to simplify character data is to literally add every possible ounce of data to every single character with a "yes/ no" flag on every single point. If you can't figure out why that doesn't fix inventory congestion, then I don't think any amount of hand holding is going to help you wrap your head around it.

"But other games do it" is because other games were coded differently from the beginning. That initial code can make or break a lot of things that are possible later in the game's life. Even Wow still has a simple 16-slot default inventory bag, which cannot be altered due to the integral role it has in the game's original source code. They've added additional storage through various means, but they've never been able to change the way that first bag works.

The FFXIV team designed the basic inventory and armory around limitations they had, both with their servers and data limits on console. The retainer system (as well as achievement and FC chests... really anything that you can notice has a loading time before displaying the contents) requires additional server capacity which they are struggling to expand on the budget they are allotted by SE. They can alleviate some of that server cost by charging for extra retainers. They don't have the budget to implement a massive system, like the one you suggest. They don't want to talk too much about budget issues in letters to subscribers, but are aware of requests. End of explanation.

[StriderShinryu]

"But other games do it" is because other games were coded differently from the beginning.

Both Guild Wars 2 and Lord of the Rings Online (plus possibly others) have added cosmetic clothing systems after release so a change in inventory handling can be done in an MMO. Now, is it as easy, quick or simple as some people believe? I highly doubt it, but it's not true to say it is impossible. Can the staff that currently works on FF14 do it, and do it within a reasonable time frame, is the real question.

[Lego3400]

They outright said no to a glamour log, saying it takes just as much inventory space even though plenty of other games can do it. c:

The sad thing is, Blizzard announced today at Blizzcon a fairly robust log. It even has the ability to look at all the quest you've done and auto flag all the rewards (Even the ones you didn't choose) and mark them int your log....
I normally give blizzard all sorts of crap about their dev cycle and SE all sorts of praise, but if they can pull it off....

[Colorful]

The sad thing is, Blizzard announced today at Blizzcon a fairly robust log. It even has the ability to look at all the quest you've done and auto flag all the rewards (Even the ones you didn't choose) and mark them int your log....
I normally give blizzard all sorts of crap about their dev cycle and SE all sorts of praise, but if they can pull it off....

Yep, heard about that too. So much for the excuse some of the players have been throwing around that the game wasn't built with it in mind, when WoW clearly wasn't and the code is 11 years now, yet they can manage to change it to allow the best glamour log I've seen in a game thus far, while SE can't even give us more retainers (I'm a little salty about that).

[Lego3400]

Yep, heard about that too. So much for the excuse some of the players have been throwing around that the game wasn't built with it in mind, when WoW clearly wasn't and the code is 11 years now, yet they can manage to change it to allow the best glamour log I've seen in a game thus far, while SE can't even give us more retainers (I'm a little salty about that).

I will point out though, that the transmog system was something Blizzard patched in many years after the game launched so it's possible the code was much easier to re-write as it's not part of the core systems. On the filpside and the topic of core systems, they haven't quite been able to figure out how to make the default backpack any bigger. (They said they tried, only for items to vanish from it, only to end up being mailed back to the owner.) Their inventory was designed to be modular aside from said backpack so they're able to slowly increase it in size (Their bank is too, as it has bag slots), unlike our inventory which has a pretty clearly defined size. The two of these things may explain some of our issues (A set inventory size that is drilled into the core of the system and hard to change without breaking something)

[Colorful]

I will point out though, that the transmog system was something Blizzard patched in many years after the game launched so it's possible the code was much easier to re-write as it's not part of the core systems. On the filpside and the topic of core systems, they haven't quite been able to figure out how to make the default backpack any bigger. (They said they tried, only for items to vanish from it, only to end up being mailed back to the owner.) Their inventory was designed to be modular aside from said backpack so they're able to slowly increase it in size (Their bank is too, as it has bag slots), unlike our inventory which has a pretty clearly defined size, which may explain some of our issues.

Can that argument not be made for a glamour log too? There exists no such system, and as such it would be a completely new addition. It would take quite a bit of work but not to the point of reworking the entire game, just the glamour system and considering this game is almost a dress up game with the variety it has, there's no discussion to be had whether or not that effort would be worth it (a definite yes). I believe the glamour system was also added in 2.1 (correct me if I'm wrong), meaning it's not attached to the core code of the game in anyway, just an addition. It all boils down to SE not wanting to give them more money to host the data I'd think, without a return why bother? Even with Activision having a merger with Blizzard they still doubled their development team, and throw huge money into the project even when it's not as popular as it used be. FFXIV only gets more popular without an increase in budget (can't say I've heard a business not expanding on a successful venture before).

What I would do for something like this in FFXIV...
=(




Edit before posting: I guess you were talking about the inventory? Even then, they've shown that they're capable of more retainer space, so they really have no excuse there.

[Lego3400]

Edit before posting: I guess you were talking about the inventory? Even then, they've shown that they're capable of more retainer space, so they really have no excuse there.

Bit of both. We don't know how core to the system the glamour stuff is, a lot of the features patched in during 2.X were stuff they wanted in during launch but didn't have time for. You are right it was added in a patch, but we have no idea if the groundwork was laid and the finishing touches were added, or if it was created whole-cloth during that time. I'm just speculating at random here really (Also I'm about ready to fall asleep). That said retainers however are clearly designed to be modular in number. You don't have to hire any if you don't want to.


Also Blizz doubling their team did not work out. It's why the game is in the state it's in and all the massive content droughts they've had.

[Colorful]

Bit of both. We don't know how core to the system the glamour stuff is, a lot of the features patched in during 2.X were stuff they wanted in during launch but didn't have time for. You are right it was added in a patch, but we have no idea if the groundwork was laid and the finishing touches were added, or if it was created whole-cloth during that time. I'm just speculating at random here really (Also I'm about ready to fall asleep). That said retainers however are clearly designed to be modular in number. You don't have to hire any if you don't want to.


Also Blizz doubling their team did not work out. It's why the game is in the state it's in and all the massive content droughts they've had.

Fair enough, no one knows for sure whether the glamour system was planned or not, did 1.0 feature a system similar to it? From what I've been told they used the scraps of 1.0 and put together 2.0 in a short timeframe, so if there was no glamour system in 1.0 I do doubt it already almost complete before 2.0's release, but put off until 2.x for whatever reason. But as you said, just speculation. About the retainers, that's my point. Why are we forced to not only forced to pay for them, but rent them. Renting inventory space is a concept unheard of in even F2P MMOs.

I believe the content droughts were a thing far before they doubled their team, but that's more so due to poor management and the fact that they don't work 16+ hours a day like the FFXIV development team (I mean, Yoshida and the core team didn't even get that 1-2 week vacation). There is no denying that they have been far more ambitious and every system they've implemented since then has been on a far larger scale than beforehand, not to mention the significant engine improvements, along with the updated visuals that would not have been possible without the increased development team. Regardless, that wasn't my point. It's that if even Activision Blizzard is willing to put a significant amount of money into a project that's losing popularity while SE isn't willing to give the development a single extra dime even with the increased profits and growing popularity of the game.