PLD cant even hold the aggro for Alexander savage ...

[MeeYow]

Hate isn't a problem even in sword oath but 123 sucks. Everyone is right this doesn't deserve a new thread (bumping it anyway woop woop).

The actual number is ~63% of WARs DPS, we have data, use it.
http://www.fflogs.com/statistics/7#boss=18&class=Tanks

Previous imbalance was and never will be a valid justification for imbalance now, there is no argument for having imbalance.
Also, it was only patch 2.0, vs WAR>PLD for the entirety 1.x, much longer than 2.0. PLD is the one with the worse history.

[Kuwagami]

The actual number is ~63% of WARs DPS, we have data, use it.
http://www.fflogs.com/statistics/7#boss=18&class=Tanks

urgh, that's why I hate it when people bring out parsers as proofs rather than as raw numbers. FFlogs proves nothing. It ignores all the situations. Paladin tanking more in shield than sword because they lose a GCD, do not have infuriate-like skill when they have to go back to tank stance if they dance, paladin not having SE...

on your AS1 example, WARs can tank it with 0 damage penalty during the entire fight. that's not the case for PLDs

Not even counting the fact that FFlogs rely on parses shared by the community, not on ALL datas from every single player out there. Nor the fact that there are much more parses from WARs than from PLDs.

The parsing tests conducted in the pre-AS days were showing PLDs at ~900, DRKs at ~950-1000 and WARs at ~1050-1100 (in equal conditions, i.e with constant SE or equivalent debuff on the dummy)

[IskarJarak]

on your AS1 example, WARs can tank it with 0 damage penalty during the entire fight. that's not the case for PLDs

I dunno about other PLD's, but I do that fight in SwO from start to finish

[Kuwagami]

snip

Just to point out that you can say anything with numbers if you aren't paying enough attention at their real value, PLD now have 78% of WARs dps, using FFlogs to back me up.

If you want to use numbers to show that XX class lacks personal dps compared to YY class, you have to use comparable numbers, i.e. dummy parse. It will ignore raid dps and thus be moot in real situation, but at least your "personal dps" comparison will be correct.

I dunno about other PLD's, but I do that fight in SwO from start to finish

I have never met any PLD eating plasma at i200 in full STR gear without ShO. It could be bad tanks, bad healers, or a mix of both. It's also just my experience, so there could be people who can do it with their group.

[SpookyGhost]

Just to point out that you can say anything with numbers if you aren't paying enough attention at their real value, PLD now have 78% of WARs dps, using FFlogs to back me up.

Actually, PLD deals 90% of WAR's DPS and DRK is the highest DPS tank.

pls nerf DRK ; _ ;

[IskarJarak]

I have never met any PLD eating plasma at i200 in full STR gear without ShO. It could be bad tanks, bad healers, or a mix of both. It's also just my experience, so there could be people who can do it with their group.

first and third you have rampart and sentinel, second hallowed ground... then all those extra cds for when healers need to catch up... on average i get hit for 8-9k on first and third, i wear a pentamelded accessory and one 210 fending... only time i have an issue is if we don't down the oppressor fast enough and i get mini'd from last set of adds... (so like maybe i die but the boss dies around the same time no biggie :P)

[SpookyGhost]

The actual number is ~63% of WARs DPS, we have data, use it.
http://www.fflogs.com/statistics/7#boss=18&class=Tanks.

This is an average of all parses uploaded to FFLogs that contain a WAR/PLD/DRK. There are a million variables that are unaccounted for. Raid DPS is a massive factor in how much personal DPS you will gain, which also influences kill times, which in turn can skip phases (see: 0 jump A1S parses). The most controlled environment to compare static DPS between PLD and WAR is a dummy, since Shield Swipe is a DPS loss. You'd also have to determine if you're comparing OT or MT parses, which would be a bit more complicated (due to no longer getting the damage reflect from Vengeance, needing to maintain aggro, etc).

Basically, right now, numbers are hard to actually use as "data", but broader statements like "WAR DPS is higher than PLD" would hold true.

This doesn't affect PLD's aggro holding ability, though. If a PLD wants to hold aggro, it can. With enough Slaying, a proper weapon, and optionally a NIN, you shouldn't have any issues what so ever.