Bard - they broke my job

[Judge_Xero]

The REAL issue with Bard and Machinist DPS is that they're currently tuned to where their numbers are on-par with other dps if a Dragoon is present and they fall pretty significantly without one.

Looking at Oppressor, every 1300+ BRD has a DRG in the party, and that's already 150-200 behind the top dps. The absolute best Bard without a Dragoon in their party is at 1211 in a one-jump kill, about 10% behind the top bard overall (1358). This is what should be looked at when discussing the parity of WM. The fact that a Bard on its own is a solid 250-300 behind the top dps (>25%) without the help of a Dragoon is worrying. In my opinion, if Yoship wants all of the classes to be dealing good damage, those 1350s should be no-dragoon, allowing them to rise to 1460-1480 with dragoon support. Disembowel should be a BONUS to their damage, not a REQUIREMENT for them to even be in contention.


Sauce being fflogs.

But at the same time I don't think SE wants parties consisting of,

BRD, BRD, DRG, Magic. Or BRD, BRD, BRD, DRG. If BRD can match or surpass Melee DPS with a DRG in the party, then you may run into that type of issue. Ranged, Support + Top DPS?!!? (not to mention decent sustained ST and, great burst and decent AOE)

Lots of great ideas in this thread for sure, but having the player base do job balancing makes me cringe a little.

It would be nice if there was an alternative to DRG applying the pierce debuff, but in the end, each class needs to remain relevant. Like, BRD can't be the one to do it, because BRD, BRD, + 2 X Mage would be so unbelievably OP and DRG is relevant because it does supply the debuff.

It would be nice if the Trilogy was just that. 3 jobs, 1 Tank, 1 Healer, 1 DPS.

[Sleigh]

But at the same time I don't think SE wants parties consisting of,

BRD, BRD, DRG, Magic. Or BRD, BRD, BRD, DRG. If BRD can match or surpass Melee DPS with a DRG in the party, then you may run into that type of issue. Ranged, Support + Top DPS?!!? (not to mention decent sustained ST and, great burst and decent AOE)

Well it could be something like MCH + BRD + DRG natural damage is buffed by 4-5% then Disembowel is nerfed to only 5% boost to fulfill a DRG is less of a mandatory position thing. Personally though, I'm somewhat okay with DRG being semi-required, and something like that is an awful lot of work/tuning for something that isn't really a problem IMO.

Definitely agree that DRG + 2 support shouldn't be allowed to be better than it already can be, MCH/BRD with DRG is pretty insane still.

[Janise]

I started playing this game in June - Was a long time FFXI player before that. In that time taken Ninja as the first job to 52 - got pissed off with Mudra lag and chnaged to Bard and have so far taken that to 57. So I dont have the benefit of years of maining Bard the way some of the vets do on this thread. But here is the rub Ninja for 50 was the same job with added abilities to weave in in. Bard was almost like starting a whole new class aal over again. I really enjoyed Bard to 50- It was a lot of fun and form then on its been a grind - I'm a casual Player - I dont really care about Deeps or any of that stuff but SE have sure sucked the fun out of that job. what with the lag on Mudra and this I'm beginning to wonder whether its worth carrying on the subsciption. I really like this game but the quaity of execution really seems to suck. In FFXI there were always nerfs but NEVER anything that actually fundamentally chnaged the playstyle of a particular job.

[Hieral]

If your DPS as bard IN WANDERER'S MINUET feels weak, you suck. No offense. Just being honest.

[Inferiae]

If your DPS as bard IN WANDERER'S MINUET feels weak, you suck. No offense. Just being honest.

I appreciate your insight about the current BRD situation, enlightening us with your vast knowledge about the job.
I also want to point out how brilliant your statement was, clearly a sign that you read all the posts in this thread.

10/10.

[Valkyrie-Amber]

I appreciate your insight about the current BRD situation, enlightening us with your vast knowledge about the job.
I also want to point out how brilliant your statement was, clearly a sign that you read all the posts in this thread.

10/10.

omg lol same cause like drg hits almost double brds dps wanders really isn't 30% buff more like 20% cause we lose auto and if have to move 15% at best us less in short fights its useless..

[Inferiae]

omg lol same cause like drg hits almost double brds dps wanders really isn't 30% buff more like 20% cause we lose auto and if have to move 15% at best us less in short fights its useless..

Uhm, no? Dragoon has more DPS than BRD, yes. But double? Not even close. Wanderer's Minuet is a DPS increase, doesn't matter how you look at it.

My point is, most of the complaints about the current BRD situation are not related to DPS output at all.

[BrokenFox]

wanders minute sux delete it

[RinchanNau]

I think BRD damage is in a pretty good spot for the utility we provide. Certainly not opposed to QoL changes, but the job seems fine to me as far as raid DPS/utility contribution. I enjoyed playing BRD main for Alexander savage even if I don't love all the encounters. A3 is the most fun of the bunch.

The idea of reducing the effect of Disembowel while gaining the lost percentage of damage somewhere else is somewhat appealing. Especially as gear scales up and the amount of damage that Disembowel provides continues to increase. But we'll just have to wait and see what Square Enix thinks is best. Overall I am mostly content even if slide casting my way up to a target to Repelling Shot can be a bit goofy looking.

[Deviant1]

Wanders Minuet is a reduction in damage for anything outside of training dummies.

By the math, it would be at best marginal: +30% damage with -25% damage from auto-attacks leaves just 5% boost. While Barrage-emp arrow can put up a good spike, the complexity and way that WM works is too clunky.

WM really needs a 5 second delay in application/removal instead of the punishing 15 seconds 'your stuck in it' so that you can remove it without it just reapplying itself. the action queue makes it so that you hit the button, have to wait to see if it is really removed and then proceed... and half the time it doesnt work or takes too long so you hit it again, only to reapply it...

As for Bard DPS, oh hells ya thats broken. Even in the same gear and job skill equivalent, MNK,NIN, drg, blm, smn will always do more then a bard/MCH. without any songs to 'lower' dps, at full rotations they will still be 20% lower. in 2.0 brds could be equal if not pass the level of those classes, so when they used ballad/paeon it wasnt as punitive.

Despite what yoshi says there are no support jobs in a game which adheres to the tank/heal/dps trilogy so strongly. If anything the healer classes should be more supportive and let the dps classes actually do full damage.

Unfortunately i do not see this getting any better unless they fire yoshi, which i wish they would do already...