Bard - they broke my job

[JackFross]

The REAL issue with Bard and Machinist DPS is that they're currently tuned to where their numbers are on-par with other dps if a Dragoon is present and they fall pretty significantly without one.

Looking at Oppressor, every 1300+ BRD has a DRG in the party, and that's already 150-200 behind the top dps. The absolute best Bard without a Dragoon in their party is at 1211 in a one-jump kill, about 10% behind the top bard overall (1358). This is what should be looked at when discussing the parity of WM. The fact that a Bard on its own is a solid 250-300 behind the top dps (>25%) without the help of a Dragoon is worrying. In my opinion, if Yoship wants all of the classes to be dealing good damage, those 1350s should be no-dragoon, allowing them to rise to 1460-1480 with dragoon support. Disembowel should be a BONUS to their damage, not a REQUIREMENT for them to even be in contention.

Sauce being fflogs.

[Judge_Xero]

The REAL issue with Bard and Machinist DPS is that they're currently tuned to where their numbers are on-par with other dps if a Dragoon is present and they fall pretty significantly without one.

Looking at Oppressor, every 1300+ BRD has a DRG in the party, and that's already 150-200 behind the top dps. The absolute best Bard without a Dragoon in their party is at 1211 in a one-jump kill, about 10% behind the top bard overall (1358). This is what should be looked at when discussing the parity of WM. The fact that a Bard on its own is a solid 250-300 behind the top dps (>25%) without the help of a Dragoon is worrying. In my opinion, if Yoship wants all of the classes to be dealing good damage, those 1350s should be no-dragoon, allowing them to rise to 1460-1480 with dragoon support. Disembowel should be a BONUS to their damage, not a REQUIREMENT for them to even be in contention.


Sauce being fflogs.

But at the same time I don't think SE wants parties consisting of,

BRD, BRD, DRG, Magic. Or BRD, BRD, BRD, DRG. If BRD can match or surpass Melee DPS with a DRG in the party, then you may run into that type of issue. Ranged, Support + Top DPS?!!? (not to mention decent sustained ST and, great burst and decent AOE)

Lots of great ideas in this thread for sure, but having the player base do job balancing makes me cringe a little.

It would be nice if there was an alternative to DRG applying the pierce debuff, but in the end, each class needs to remain relevant. Like, BRD can't be the one to do it, because BRD, BRD, + 2 X Mage would be so unbelievably OP and DRG is relevant because it does supply the debuff.

It would be nice if the Trilogy was just that. 3 jobs, 1 Tank, 1 Healer, 1 DPS.

[Sleigh]

But at the same time I don't think SE wants parties consisting of,

BRD, BRD, DRG, Magic. Or BRD, BRD, BRD, DRG. If BRD can match or surpass Melee DPS with a DRG in the party, then you may run into that type of issue. Ranged, Support + Top DPS?!!? (not to mention decent sustained ST and, great burst and decent AOE)

Well it could be something like MCH + BRD + DRG natural damage is buffed by 4-5% then Disembowel is nerfed to only 5% boost to fulfill a DRG is less of a mandatory position thing. Personally though, I'm somewhat okay with DRG being semi-required, and something like that is an awful lot of work/tuning for something that isn't really a problem IMO.

Definitely agree that DRG + 2 support shouldn't be allowed to be better than it already can be, MCH/BRD with DRG is pretty insane still.