Dear Yoshi P: What is your vision?

[User201109011315]

Well you have no proof of what your saying is correct other than pushing what unreleased games are doing, which can change from the final product. All you're saying is he should have a "bird's eye view", which doesn't mean anything. Also they haven't been listening to every complaint, if they have then we wouldn't be moving over to this new claiming system, you'll still have your NQ/+1,+2,+3 system and parts. So obviously they have their vision for the game. Adding what is reasonable from community is a plus. It shows that they're listening to the community and it makes the players feel like they have a part in making the game, but that doesn't mean the players will always have a say in the game.

So what's the vision? Is it pandering to complaints or is it not? Is it what he said in that quote from Azury or is it what you said?

That's all we want to know.

What formula does Yoshi use to decide which complaints to listen to?

This is what we want to know. This is all we are asking for.

[Azurymber]

Yes, you would know right, since you're some kind game developer/producer right?

to be fair you can assume that since almost every game on the market has some kind of a vision behind it (even single player games) its somewhat of a necessity for success. I mean if you want to see a -really- good example of a game with a vision check out the vids for elder scrolls V skyrim. The main dev guy really explains what he wants people to feel when playing the game and how he wants his game world to be, as well as why they chose to do things a certain way.

Even the star wars TOR vids talk about their vision and what they expect out of the game.

And not mentioning your vision or what your updates intend to change, causes problems:

For example:

People thought the future of FFXIV was coblyn grinding for the longest time because no one bothered to say "we realize there is a problem and intend to fix it"

It took weeks for Yoshi-P to say that leve-linking + failing was not an intended way to SP, even though tons of people were arguing that it was SE's intention for it to be like that and saying "there is a tradeoff, if you fail leves you dont get rewards" as their justification for it being an intended part of the game.

A week after 1.18 was released i posted this thread:Asking how to Solo SP

and got responses like:

"Yoshi says that the way you leveled up before was too fast and should take months if you go solo."
"Next look and see what level your character is. Your goal is to aim for mobs around that level."
"I don't know if it's normal but with LNC @ rank 20 I can't solo mobs of rank 5 or higher above mine."
"Soloing is painfully slow right now."
"Soloing, I don't think you will be able to find the kind of exp you're looking for, but if I figure out anything I'll post it."
etc
basically a bunch of people saying solo'ing isn't really viable anymore and that Yoshi-P changed it so that people party....
So i played around, tryed a bunch of stuff, and came up with my solo guide which can often net you the same or near what a party can get in SP per hour.

point being, by not stating a vision or intentions, people completely ignored an entire aspect of the game for weeks.

And I really see that as a problem

[Konachibi]

I can see what you're getting at, playing on your own does seem kinda "eh" right now.

When I grind I tend to ask in linkshell for a party, multiple players makes it easier, and... kinda fulfills the purpose of playing a multiplayer game.

I'm not saying that to knock you though, that solo guide is amazingly informative and I'm defenitely going to use it, at least for knowing what enemies I can kill and therefore, what materials I can gather with my highest battle class.

One thing that kinda confuses me though and tips me to one side is that the instruction book gives you no tips on where to go or what to do when you start the game, it just sort of puts you there and you work it out yourself. The crafting also doesn't have a trainer that gives recipes, leves give recipes but many of them you work out by yourself.
And one of the first things I read in the Lodestone forums when I joined FFXIV was "Nothing here tells you what to do, do what you want to do with this, that's the beauty of it."

This kind of lead me to believe, and I still believe, that most of the aspects to this game are found through discovery, not by having it shown to you or handed to you on a silver platter with in-depth instructions on what to do next.

That being said, those responses you posted read to me as "We don't know and we can't be bothered to find out." apart from this one: "Soloing, I don't think you will be able to find the kind of exp you're looking for, but if I figure out anything I'll post it."

You yourself went to find out and discovered methods of solo levelling on your own, S.E didn't tell you how to do it. That makes your solo guide commendable.

That's just how I kinda feel about this game though, it's nice not to be lead around on it like a dog on a leash like most other mmo's do, I go where I want when I want and do what I want.

And I believe that was one of the original aims for the game and the purpose for the armory system wasn't it, to allow that extra level of freedom?

[Sonic_the_Hedgehog]

So what's the vision? Is it pandering to complaints or is it not? Is it what he said in that quote from Azury or is it what you said?

That's all we want to know.

What formula does Yoshi use to decide which complaints to listen to?

This is what we want to know. This is all we are asking for.

His vision isn't tied to fixing everyone's complaints, that's what they're doing now to bring the game up to par.

His vision is no matter your playing style (or how much time you have to play) you'll have something to do in Eorzea. That can mean having more leves, instances, open world NMs, and quests. When you log in you should have something to do, also the content you tackle should be challenging and take skill. If that's not the vision you want, then TERA is already out in Japan, so get to playing it.

[Sonic_the_Hedgehog]

to be fair you can assume that since almost every game on the market has some kind of a vision behind it (even single player games) its somewhat of a necessity for success. I mean if you want to see a -really- good example of a game with a vision check out the vids for elder scrolls V skyrim. The main dev guy really explains what he wants people to feel when playing the game and how he wants his game world to be, as well as why they chose to do things a certain way.

Even the star wars TOR vids talk about their vision and what they expect out of the game.

And not mentioning your vision or what your updates intend to change, causes problems:

For example:

People thought the future of FFXIV was coblyn grinding for the longest time because no one bothered to say "we realize there is a problem and intend to fix it"

It took weeks for Yoshi-P to say that leve-linking + failing was not an intended way to SP, even though tons of people were arguing that it was SE's intention for it to be like that and saying "there is a tradeoff, if you fail leves you dont get rewards" as their justification for it being an intended part of the game.

A week after 1.18 was released i posted this thread:Asking how to Solo SP

and got responses like:

"Yoshi says that the way you leveled up before was too fast and should take months if you go solo."
"Next look and see what level your character is. Your goal is to aim for mobs around that level."
"I don't know if it's normal but with LNC @ rank 20 I can't solo mobs of rank 5 or higher above mine."
"Soloing is painfully slow right now."
"Soloing, I don't think you will be able to find the kind of exp you're looking for, but if I figure out anything I'll post it."
etc
basically a bunch of people saying solo'ing isn't really viable anymore and that Yoshi-P changed it so that people party....
So i played around, tryed a bunch of stuff, and came up with my solo guide which can often net you the same or near what a party can get in SP per hour.

point being, by not stating a vision or intentions, people completely ignored an entire aspect of the game for weeks.

And I really see that as a problem

Those problems seem like a lack of communication, than a lack of vision. Also if they came out and said "hey coblyn grinding is wrong!" then everyone would know that they are gonna nerf it, thus leading to people hurrying out trying to grind as much as possible before they changed it.

[Konachibi]

His vision isn't tied to fixing everyone's complaints, that's what they're doing now to bring the game up to par.

His vision is no matter your playing style (or how much time you have to play) you'll have something to do in Eorzea. That can mean having more leves, instances, open world NMs, and quests. When you log in you should have something to do, also the content you tackle should be challenging and take skill. If that's not the vision you want, then TERA is already out in Japan, so get to playing it.

Will FFXIV allow me to increase my breast size by x10 and make them bounce like jelly like in Tera? No? Aww

*fetches pen and paper*

Dear Yoshi...

[User201109011315]

His vision isn't tied to fixing everyone's complaints, that's what they're doing now to bring the game up to par.

But what formula does he use to decide what needs "fixing"? Sometimes his fixes look like breakages to me! So HOW is he "bringing the game up to par"? There is no scientific answer. To answer that question is subject, and thus to answer it, Yoshi needs to have a vision.

So filtering complaints requires a vision, otherwise how do you know which complaint to listen to?

His vision is no matter your playing style (or how much time you have to play) you'll have something to do in Eorzea. That can mean having more leves, instances, open world NMs, and quests. When you log in you should have something to do, also the content you tackle should be challenging and take skill. If that's not the vision you want, then TERA is already out in Japan, so get to playing it.

If his vision is simply "moar content" then one also needs to know why he chooses one form of content over another. Every game wants infinite content, but they have to prioritise. That's why some games dedicate themselves to community-based stuff, or PvP, or PvE, and different types of each.

Yoshi basically slapped some instances together because "other games do it". So is that his vision? Imitation?

Wanting a game for everyone can result in a game for no-one. How does he expect to overcome that pretty glaring problem?

And don't you think there's a big problem if you have to paraphrase and put words in his mouth just to get his so-called vision across?

No matter how many times you regurgitate stuff Yoshi has said, you're just not answering my questions, sorry. And that's because Yoshi never answered these questions.

[Sonic_the_Hedgehog]

But what formula does he use to decide what needs "fixing"? Sometimes his fixes look like breakages to me! So HOW is he "bringing the game up to par"? There is no scientific answer. To answer that question is subject, and thus to answer it, Yoshi needs to have a vision.

They want to bring up what currently released MMOs have, the "current MMO standard". They have said this.

So filtering complaints requires a vision, otherwise how do you know which complaint to listen to?

The ones that fit in with his vision.


If his vision is simply "moar content" then one also needs to know why he chooses one form of content over another. Every game wants infinite content, but they have to prioritise. That's why some games dedicate themselves to community-based stuff, or PvP, or PvE, and different types of each.

Yoshi basically slapped some instances together because "other games do it". So is that his vision? Imitation?

Wanting a game for everyone can result in a game for no-one. How does he expect to overcome that pretty glaring problem?

And don't you think there's a big problem if you have to paraphrase and put words in his mouth just to get his so-called vision across?

I didn't put words into his mouth, read his interviews, it's there.

No matter how many times you regurgitate stuff Yoshi has said, you're just not answering my questions, sorry. And that's because Yoshi never answered these questions.

I tried looking up this Jake guy's press release and couldn't find it, but I found a video of him just talking about the technology they put in the game, which isn't a vision.

9823749hw0ehf9owiejfijwe0fioo0iew

[User201109011315]

9823749hw0ehf9owiejfijwe0fioo0iew

http://www.mmoculture.com/2011/07/ch...ew-on-mmo.html
http://www.betacake.net/2011/08/arch...-songs_03.html

He actually gives a "big picture" for what the MMO should be like. Rather than just saying "we might add this thing here" and "cut this feature here" "just because".

GW2 devs are the same. If you just go to their main site, they release huge articles about their features and why they decide to implement features in that specific way and how it will make their game a success.

Yoshi's just like "yeah let's just implement this because someone complained". There's just no big picture. sorry.

[Konachibi]

9823749hw0ehf9owiejfijwe0fioo0iew

Gah don't quote his ridiculously unscrupulous posts! Now I can see again the mindless kerfuffle that comes blasting out of his already warped and incomprehensible mind!

I'm In Despair!

... always wanted to find a good place to use that clip...