Having Tanks that are worse or better needs to go.

[Nektulos-Tuor]

We already see the literal hundreds of threads asking for X and Y to be changed and worrying about Y and X not being able to do one thing whilst another does it a lot better. This kind of game design goes back to the flaws of DPS doing more damage against certain creatures, like Black Mage's fire doing more damage to ice creatures. This type of thing was removed for a reason yet..

Why are Warriors good at mitigating everything?
Why are Dark Knights better at Magic?
Why are Paladins better at Physical?

This, is bad! Not only is this a balancing Nightmare but it discourages people from playing what they want. All the tanks should be unique and special and different from each other, surviving in different ways rather then being worse in the same situation.

How can we fix this?


Paladin need a lot of changes, they should still be the best at mitigation physical but I believe the shield should also mitigate magical damage. The lore proves it can when you know who made the ultimate sacrifice. Shields not being able to block magic is a VERY silly concept and honestly this change would be big enough to make the class viable in most of the content. If Shields blocked magic and all its blocking moves also helped they would be very nice in current content. Also giving them more ways to deal damage especially in AOE would be a good change as well.

Warrior doesn't need any changes because its honestly one of the best designed classes in the game. People say its overpowered but its really not. Its well designed and that is that. The only skill I would change is fracture and making their stance actually work for "All healing" even their own.

Dark Knight's should not be so magical focused. In fact that part of them needs nerfed to have better all-around defense. Honestly however they don't have anything unique to them if you remove that part of them, so how can we fix them up to be unique? Simple: Make them a Blood Tank that heals through gathering Hatred and Blood Shields and Lifetaps. Remove the Magical defenses and make them like a Reaver. Remove the RNG mechanics as well. Dark Knight's are way too much like Paladins and they need their own identity. Dark Knight's should also be doing a bit more damage, and their defenses should not be changed with another GCD.

Dark Arts problem: A lot of a Dark Knight's defenses are only good if you use them with "Dark Arts". This is an issue because lets say you see something you want to block, you use your ability but WAIT... you have to Dark Arts it first, so you use Dark arts and SMACK, already been hit with it. That is honestly bad game design and I would rather have another mechanic for the class. That mechanic is not bad for a DPS class, but its NOT good for a tanking class.




The reason i'm honestly bringing this up, is because no other class in the game has to deal with this issue. DPS no longer does more damage against certain monsters. There are no monsters who take more damage from certain moves anymore, and this was a good change. However TANKS are still like this? Why? We can already see its causing problems.

[Valkyrie-Amber]

Just no if plds don't get any dps buffs why should the other 2 tanks get defense buffs?

[Martin_Arcainess]

Learn to play DRK right because honestly you don't seem to have a clue how to fully use or even fully appreciate DRk for what it is.
I don't know if you are serious about the posts you make or just some troll but you always seem to moan about the DRK, Do you even have it to 60?!

DRk is a kick ass class and if you don't like go play another class. You say DRK is a reskin of PLD, true it's has similar actions and skills but anyone who played and have DRK at 60 you would know it's not a reskin of PLD.

PLD doesn't have a ground AOE *Slated Earth, PLD can't quickly jump to targets, *Plunge, it has more off GCD then PLD dose, it has DA which makes the DRK so fun to play with, if you get hit by a big attack that requires DA+DM to midgate like A1S TB then it's not bad game design, it's you being a bad player and even more PLD doesn't relie on MP the same way DRK dose.....yeah they're so alike............

so you kinda contradicted yourself, you complainted is about
"Why are Warriors good at mitigating everything?
Why are Dark Knights better at Magic?
Why are Paladins better at Physical?
This, is bad! Not only is this a balancing Nightmare but it discourages people from playing what they want. All the tanks should be unique and special and different from each other, surviving in different ways rather then being worse in the same situation."

So you're suggesting Tanks be different but also complaining about there Differences?


There is nothing wrong with Tanks beining different, feck me you would have made a complaint thread if they was all the same and I for one appreciate how each tank is different.

ok rant over.

[Risvertasashi]

Just no if plds don't get any dps buffs why should the other 2 tanks get defense buffs?

It seems to me the OP suggested a DPS buff for PLDs (among other things), and said that Warrior does not need a defense buff.

On what basis are you making your comment?

[Nektulos-Tuor]

Learn to play DRK right because honestly you don't seem to have a clue how to fully use or even fully appreciate DRk for what it is.
I don't know if you are serious about the posts you make or just some troll but you always seem to moan about the DRK, Do you even have it to 60?!

DRk is a kick ass class and if you don't like go play another class. You say DRK is a reskin of PLD, true it's has similar actions and skills but anyone who played and have DRK at 60 you would know it's not a reskin of PLD.

PLD doesn't have a ground AOE *Slated Earth, PLD can't quickly jump to targets, *Plunge, it has more off GCD then PLD dose, it has DA which makes the DRK so fun to play with, if you get hit by a big attack that requires DA+DM to midgate like A1S TB then it's not bad game design, it's you being a bad player and even more PLD doesn't relie on MP the same way DRK dose.....yeah they're so alike............

so you kinda contradicted yourself, you complainted is about
"Why are Warriors good at mitigating everything?
Why are Dark Knights better at Magic?
Why are Paladins better at Physical?
This, is bad! Not only is this a balancing Nightmare but it discourages people from playing what they want. All the tanks should be unique and special and different from each other, surviving in different ways rather then being worse in the same situation."

So you're suggesting Tanks be different but also complaining about there Differences?


There is nothing wrong with Tanks beining different, feck me you would have made a complaint thread if they was all the same and I for one appreciate how each tank is different.

ok rant over.

Then your idea is to have one tank be better then all the others for content. I am sure that is cool for you but its honestly terrible game design. Also - cussing at me doesn't help your case. You could also learn to write a bit better, i'm having a hard time understanding your post.

Dark Knight's defenses are clunky. You saying "BUT I THINK THEY ARE NOT!" then.. offering no proof or opinion why leads me to believe you don't know what your talking about. Can you please reword your post better?

"Learn to play and cussing." doesn't really say anything to help the topic and doesn't prove your point or help it.

[Kenji1134]

As far as X class is better at mitigating Y damage, the only time you care is when Y damage is the prominent type of damage in Z endgame content...

The solution is simple.
Give every boss 2 DIFFERENT tank busters, in 1 of 2 "flavors".

Obviously the 2 different tank busters would be physical and magic, the 2 flavors would be a Single strong hit (Hypercompressed Plasma), or Multiple hits in rapid succession (Nael's Rage of Bahamut stabbing spree or Elidibus' Triple).

PLD would have a slight advantage against the Single Physical TB due to Sheltron taking about 30% off the huge hit.
DRK would have a slight advantage against Magical TB's due to Dark Mind.
WAR would arguably have a slight advantage against Multiple Physical TB's due to Raw Intuition taking 20% off each smaller hit, PLD has Bulwark but that is less reliable.

Of course the introduction of an extra TB would require more time between TB's, and it would force tanks to make somewhat more intelligent use of CD's, such as using General Mitigation abilities for X TB, and Physical/Magic for the other, as opposed to "blow everything relevant, it'll be up for the next one!"

Hell, lets add a 3rd form of TB while we're at it, the "Anti-Death Ignoring (Execution) Tank Buster". The idea is simply that this ability MUST be mitigated down to reasonable values using CD's, and will kill you through invulnerability buffs such as HG, Holmgang, and Living Dead.

[bounddreamer]

Still not sure if OP is a troll or not...

If they aren't it's kinda worse.

[LeeraSorlan]

I dont care

[Delily]

Dark Knight's defenses are clunky. You saying "BUT I THINK THEY ARE NOT!" then.. offering no proof or opinion why leads me to believe you don't know what your talking about. Can you please reword your post better?

How exactly are they clunky? For trash, you pull, you pop Shadowskin and Blood Price, and when then falls off, if there's anything left, you pop Dark Arts and Dark Dance. You alternate between intentionally taking hits to regen mana to avoiding hits. For boss fights, you just use whatever defense you need to.

[Martin_Arcainess]

Here's a bottle of gin then you might understand better, or whisky, or cider, whatever you drink.

Seriously dude most of your post doesn't make sense as whole.

2 questions, 1 Have you cleared any of Alexander Savage? 2, Do you have all 3 Tank classes to 60 to even fully understand how each class works?

All Tank issues is based on how well they perform in raids, Which at the moment is Alexander Savage.

Also you must be slow as heck to not do a DA+DM in time for a heavy tank buster or can't remember the boss rotations for it.

Which pretty much all the Pro tanks do, remember when the boss TB is coming so you can prepare for it, healers do it as well.