A few ideas from an apparently little known game

[Ldempsey]

So, I have a question. Am I the only person thats played EQ? I rarely see references to ideas that can be expanded upon to a great game, and one the of the original mmorpgs. Dont get me wrong, both titles had its flaws, but Im pretty sure you'll be hard to find a game thats ran as long as eq1 and is still pumping out new content. Its not just here, ive been around for a few title launches that no one ever mentions one of my all time favorite games.

Anyway, to get to my point, with these class systems, I was a huge fan, and very disappointed when they got rid of, the original class system with eq2. Since I seem to be the only dinosaur here, Ill fill you in.

At launch of eq2, u created your character as either a warrior, mage, scout, or priest. The first 10 level you played as these very basic classes, learning basic skills as taunt, sneak, a few heals, that kind of thing. At level 10 you did a class quest, that explained the different roles of your options, gave you hands on tasks, to demonstrate the pluses and minuses, and then let you pick between 2 subclasses. At level 20, the same kind of thing happened that left you with your actual class, the classes that later became the ones you could pick through at character creation.

This system gave you a great feel for all of the classes in your archtype and really felt like it was all up to you the type of character you played, based on your play style, instead of just picking a preset class at the very beginning and hoping you like it.

I think this possibly combined with a style similar to the final fantasy tactics class system (having to have a certain rank in class A, another rank in class B, to have class C available) would be amazing to have, and provide a high level of specialization. Along with what we called an "Advanced Achievement" tree which provided even more specialization among the classes, your options would almost be unlimited.

Also with pvp, EQ2 had pvp servers, along with arenas and duels in all servers, I never recall them ever nerfing classes specifically for pvp reason, but I know some abilities affected players different than mobs. I think the arena idea had excellent potential, even going as far as having pets you could find, and raise to fight against others' in the arena. However there was really no incentive for going, so after the novelty wore off it was a ghost town. Possibly having cash prizes for winning, or extra xp or something of the like?

Dont get me wrong, I by no means want to see a eq2 clone, quite the contrary I believe eq2 got rid of a lot of the better features it originally set out with. (dont even get me started on the crafting!) But I think if the brilliant minds at SE took some of these ideas and ran with them, they could come up with some real attractive qualities.

What do you guys think about such a class system? Forgive me if this seems confusing, I just got off a long day at work and seem a bit fried, I can clarify any points if need be.

[Laughlyn]

All i see here are a wall of text & too much EQ.
Sorry no never played it but from pictures ive seen it looks very simmilar to FFXI's gamestyle.



So... imo, i liked FF5, FFT & FFXI's classes.

[MariyaShidou]

The reason why you never see people reference EQ2 is because, despite EQ success, EQ2 got killed by *cough* the other MMO released in that year, and today it has become F2P. Plus it never reached 350k sub in its life.

http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

The only two games in that chart that are steadily growing is EVE and Doofus (lol). If anything I would referenced Doofus since I played that game as a subscriber for half a year, and they are currently developing another MMO to be published by SE. How did such a grindy grind game with barely no quest get so successful?

[Ldempsey]

Killed by "the other MMO"? I dont know if I would say that...I think SOE kinda did it themselves with the game changing patches that really left the challenge out of the game. I could spend days talking about things patched to ruin. I understand WOW was a huge competitor but personally I think EQ2 would have held its own if it wasnt messed with so much. Again just my opinion. Now eq1 on the other hand, I still have a sub to that, just so i can whip it out once every now and then and relive the my glory days lol.

Those were just a couple ideas that SOE failed to capitalize on that I think would have real possibilities especially mixed in with FF traits from previous games. Then again Mortal online had great ideas too...but those never came to be either. TBH I really like the direction 14 is heading, and cant wait to see future updates.

[MagicofGaia]

So, I have a question. Am I the only person thats played EQ? I rarely see references to ideas that can be expanded upon to a great game, and one the of the original mmorpgs. Dont get me wrong, both titles had its flaws, but Im pretty sure you'll be hard to find a game thats ran as long as eq1 and is still pumping out new content. Its not just here, ive been around for a few title launches that no one ever mentions one of my all time favorite games.

Anyway, to get to my point, with these class systems, I was a huge fan, and very disappointed when they got rid of, the original class system with eq2. Since I seem to be the only dinosaur here, Ill fill you in.

At launch of eq2, u created your character as either a warrior, mage, scout, or priest. The first 10 level you played as these very basic classes, learning basic skills as taunt, sneak, a few heals, that kind of thing. At level 10 you did a class quest, that explained the different roles of your options, gave you hands on tasks, to demonstrate the pluses and minuses, and then let you pick between 2 subclasses. At level 20, the same kind of thing happened that left you with your actual class, the classes that later became the ones you could pick through at character creation.

This system gave you a great feel for all of the classes in your archtype and really felt like it was all up to you the type of character you played, based on your play style, instead of just picking a preset class at the very beginning and hoping you like it.

I think this possibly combined with a style similar to the final fantasy tactics class system (having to have a certain rank in class A, another rank in class B, to have class C available) would be amazing to have, and provide a high level of specialization. Along with what we called an "Advanced Achievement" tree which provided even more specialization among the classes, your options would almost be unlimited.

Also with pvp, EQ2 had pvp servers, along with arenas and duels in all servers, I never recall them ever nerfing classes specifically for pvp reason, but I know some abilities affected players different than mobs. I think the arena idea had excellent potential, even going as far as having pets you could find, and raise to fight against others' in the arena. However there was really no incentive for going, so after the novelty wore off it was a ghost town. Possibly having cash prizes for winning, or extra xp or something of the like?

Dont get me wrong, I by no means want to see a eq2 clone, quite the contrary I believe eq2 got rid of a lot of the better features it originally set out with. (dont even get me started on the crafting!) But I think if the brilliant minds at SE took some of these ideas and ran with them, they could come up with some real attractive qualities.

What do you guys think about such a class system? Forgive me if this seems confusing, I just got off a long day at work and seem a bit fried, I can clarify any points if need be.

Yes, I played EQ1. As well as Ultima O, a little DAoC, Aion, and ffxi. I also tried WoW 3 different times for 1 month trials, and I never once stuck around *pukes*

Aion used the same such system as far as the 1-10, then graduating into an higher class. PvP has always been instanced such as the arena type area in ffxi. If there ever will be much pvp content in xiv, it would not be for a long time. And as xiv's races are not 'at war', I doubt there will ever be a need for multi servers as there is no 'open world' PvP.

Yoshi-p / ffxiv dev team - Not wanting to build on a premise used by other mmo's 'as much as possible'

Post 'as-unique-as-possible' ideas. Not 'This game did this, maybe xiv should do something like it'

[raenna]

[QUOTE=MariyaShidou;33221]The reason why you never see people reference EQ2 is because, despite EQ success, EQ2 got killed by *cough* the other MMO released in that year, and today it has become F2P. Plus it never reached 350k sub in its life.

There is at least 1 server that has 350k on it alone.. I dont think you have all of the facs there.. and yes it has a free to play server but the other servers are still alive and kicken, and the reason it wasn't a great success is because like FFXIV it was released unfished. AT any rate it has become a fun game, as will FFXIV in good time.

[raenna]

............

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

In regards to the Everquest 1 inspiration, Final Fantasy 11 is built or heavily inspired on Everquest 1.

In the Everquest 2 fashion, I recall that design of learning your archetype, branching into an advanced job, and at last choosing a specialist job.

i.e. Fighter -> Warrior -> Berzerker, Fighter -> Brawler -> Monk, or Fighter -> Crusader -> Shadow Knight

I'm not sure how a Final Fantasy Tactics system would have worked here. A lot could have been done with the Armory System and trying to be a jobless system, so experimentation is up in the air.

[MariyaShidou]

There is at least 1 server that has 350k on it alone.. I dont think you have all of the facs there.. and yes it has a free to play server but the other servers are still alive and kicken, and the reason it wasn't a great success is because like FFXIV it was released unfished. AT any rate it has become a fun game, as will FFXIV in good time.

I think we both don't have the fact there. Sony has NEVER released any numbers. However judging that a game has went to F2P direction can only mean that it hasn't done as good as it could. Some may say LOTRO? Well, if anything the Aion that people are bashing didn't go F2P because there are still millions subscribers and NCSoft would see no reason why they need to go F2P. Successful P2P games don't need to go F2P to strengthen themselves.

And why not learn from Doofus? It's an indie game, and yet it has gotten so successful. It doesn't have millions upon millions dollars as the cost.

[Nephera]

There's features I liked from eq2(crafting for one, housing for another) but I think i like the armory system a lot better.

As for pvp: well some people want it and as long as it doesnt affect already existing gameplay sure why not.


funny note, eq2 had a faq page back in the day which contained the phrase "eq2 will never have pvp" with never bolded and underlined.