[Suggestion] PLDs can't do Alexander Savage due to lack of DPS capabilities

[AbandonedPaladin]

To all people thinking that I am not trying hard enough when I said PLD is "broken" in terms of DPS: I have STR accessories and only keep a minimal HP to be safe during tankbusters, I swapped to Sword Oath as soon as I did my initial Rage of Halone and Goring Blade combos, I used HQ Draconian pot of Strength, I stayed Sword Oath most of the time except for the Tankbusters, I know how to time Fight or Flight right so as to maximize stance dancing, I used my defensive cooldowns not only against tank busters but also to help healers during Sword Oath, I utilize even the timing of potion using and my Divine Veil usage, even Stoneskinning myself when an opening presents itself like AS1's Flying Phase. And basically that's all it's there for PLD DPS and Utility isn't it?

[Syzygian]

I hate to say it, but the devs already responded to this with regards to PLD and their combos specifically. Yoshi P. basically said "git gud". The infuriating thing about this is that some jobs, like WAR, don't have to "git gud". They just deal crazy damage just because. They designed the job to be OP with ex As a DRK I don't have much skin in this game but I still empathize. There are some big design flaws in tanking in this game. I feel like the only way they could balance things is to nerf WAR, because PLD wouldn't need that much of a DPS buff to catch up to and even pass DRK, but people keep saying that won't happen. Guess we'll see.

[AbandonedPaladin]

I have faiths in the Devs they always come in at the right moment, so yeah we will see. But as I stressed I basically reached PLD's capstone in what to do and what should I do for DPS increase. And yet we still can't reach that magical number to be viable. Thing I would love to see though, isn't merely class buffs or nerfs, but a completely overhauling on tanking system and bossfight mechanic, not just "LOLDPSRACE" as Alex savage is right now.

[ArdorGrey]

The infuriating thing about this is that some jobs, like WAR, don't have to "git gud". They just deal crazy damage just because. They designed the job to be OP with ex As a DRK I don't have much skin in this game but I still empathize. There are some big design flaws in tanking in this game. I feel like the only way they could balance things is to nerf WAR, because PLD wouldn't need that much of a DPS buff to catch up to and even pass DRK, but people keep saying that won't happen. Guess we'll see.

Wars don't deal crazy damage "just because". They deal crazy damage when sacrificing all of their defenses, and in most cases they can't afford to do that unless content is already way overgeared. And just as you mentioned drk isnt far ahead of pld, war isn't far ahead of drk, unless you have no slashing debuff or there's a gear discrepancy. Drk's actually do *more* damage in their tank stance than warriors.

[AbandonedPaladin]

Please remember this though: Warriors can currently survive "Tankbusters" and are the "Staple" offtank due to their DPS. PLD isn't as effective a maintank as DRK on AS3 and 4, and is DEFINITELY NOT an offtank in the current "DPS-heavy" Meta. DRK isn't far ahead, but it's ahead in offensive capabilities enough to make enrage and not enrage matter. That is not to say DRK has the ABSOLUTE ADVANTAGE on both offensive and defensive capabilities come Alex savage 4. And again, please keep in mind the current Meta is "DPS-heavy" not "Coordination-heavy" or "Defense-heavy". Before stating things as facts please at first put yourself in our shoes, not in a WAR's point of view. Also, I don't ask SE to nerf any of the class but just to make the tanking balance better so that it won't be "WAR Offtank ALL the time" and "DRK trumps PLD in AS3 and 4 ALL the time" like it currently is. And if you need fact? All of the teams having cleared A4S so far are having WAR and DRK as their tanking combo.

[Syzygian]

Wars don't deal crazy damage "just because". They deal crazy damage when sacrificing all of their defenses, and in most cases they can't afford to do that unless content is already way overgeared. And just as you mentioned drk isnt far ahead of pld, war isn't far ahead of drk, unless you have no slashing debuff or there's a gear discrepancy. Drk's actually do *more* damage in their tank stance than warriors.

If you've been watching progression in savage you'll see that the amount of time WAR's spend in Defiance even while actively tanking is extremely minimal. So the fact that DRK deals more damage in Grit than WAR does in Defiance is moot b/c DRK has to make much bigger sacrifices to stance dance.

[ArdorGrey]

If you've been watching progression in savage you'll see that the amount of time WAR's spend in Defiance even while actively tanking is extremely minimal. So the fact that DRK deals more damage in Grit than WAR does in Defiance is moot b/c DRK has to make much bigger sacrifices to stance dance.

Not far behind out of tank stance (not costly or difficult when blood weapon is up at least), actually ahead in tank stance, and a gap closer to help maintain dps. Drk's aren't in a bad place at all offensively, and that doesn't make anything else "moot". If there's any issue with drk atm it's that it's going to be awfully squishy if any future content doesn't have magical tank busters.

[ArdorGrey]

snip

If you look back at the first thing I said in this thread, I completely agree pld needs some buffs, and I agree with most points Sapphidia has made.

Now that there are three tanks there is always going to be an ideal comp for every fight, so even the fact that pld isn't being actively sought for A4 isn't an issue- but the fact that they're being passed over for the ideal comp for all of Alex(even if they're making it into a few parties regardless) is. For being "the defense tank", the problem isn't even necessarily their raw dps, though I can see why better aggro generation and more damage in tank stance would be nice considering they have the hardest time swapping and are dead last by a wide margin in tank stance currently.

The problem is that on top of having lowest damage their utility isn't useful atm, and most of their "defense" doesn't do much in savage. So you have a class that's inferior offensively with a bunch of bits and bobs that don't really add to the raid.

They also have to toe a fine line while balancing this or we'll be back to Swo pld having MT on lock for the majority of fights.