SCH in 3.0. Some thoughts while healing A3S.

[PetiteMalFleur]

Whatever - I guess that opening a thread here was mildly useless

Someone disagrees with a detailed explanation as to why and rather than elaborate your point you dismiss him by essentially saying we are all stupid.

I guess the uselessness of your thread was a self fulfilled prophecy.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Someone disagrees with a detailed explanation as to why and rather than elaborate your point you dismiss him by essentially saying we are all stupid.

I guess the uselessness of your thread was a self fulfilled prophecy.

I have elaborated my points in my opening post. People disagree, I am perfectly fine with that.

But I never said that Scholar needs buffs. Again, I was talking about A3S and how, due to a series of circumstances, that fight does slightly favor the WHM toolset, in my opinion. Since A3S is pretty much all I care for atm (and since I have yet to experience A4S), yes, I am currently basing my opinion on my current endgame, which, again, is A3S. Everything else is trivial enough not to be relevant to the discussion. I do not really care if I can pull 1200 DPS in A2S. It has no relevance to A3S.

I know full well what SCH bring to a fight. As said, I have been playing it since day one. There is no need to enumerate its numerous tools, as I am perfectly familiar with them.

[PetiteMalFleur]

I have elaborated my points in my opening post. People disagree, I am perfectly fine with that.

But I never said that Scholar needs buffs. Again, I was talking about A3S and how, due to a series of circumstances, that fight does slightly favor the WHM toolset, in my opinion. Since A3S is pretty much all I care for atm (and since I have yet to experience A4S), yes, I am currently basing my opinion on my current endgame, which, again, is A3S. Everything else is trivial enough not to be relevant to the discussion. I do not really care if I can pull 1200 DPS in A2S. It has no relevance to A3S.

I know full well what SCH bring to a fight. As said, I have been playing it since day one. There is no need to enumerate its numerous tools, as I am perfectly familiar with them.

Your asked for our thoughts then dismissed them as irrelevant. I don't know what your want.

[Gallus]

I have elaborated my points in my opening post.

Let's go over your points...

SCH has always been rather rng-based, since its best tool has always been Adloquium, an awesome spell which sadly becomes stupidly MP inefficient when it does not crit.

It's a very good spell when it does not crit, and it's a godlike spell when it crits, it has a shorter cast than stoneskin and shields and heals for more than the amount of the old stoneskin. You do not simply rely on adloquium crits, you just welcome them when they happen. If you base your strategy on say T13 around adloquium crits, might as well clear that fight 20% of the time.

And this brings me to my next point. Where has our beloved crit gone? SE probably believed that stacking secondary stats too much would allow players to cheese through content, and this is why they streamlined the whole system by severely reducing the importance of those stats. Way easier to balance stuff, this way.
However, now Adlo is a much less useful tool than before. Solo healing is much more of a problem, as well as dpsing.

There isn't even a point here you are trying to make. Just more complaints about how your crit chance has been reduced. Apparently, now you can't even DPS without it xD?

WHM, on the other hand, is now able to do pretty much as much dps as a SCH (if not more, during burst dps checks...hello, Living Limb), by exploiting Presence of Mind. Funnily enough, WHM seems to also be able to solo heal tanks more efficiently due to MP saving procs, as if Adlo does not crit, the SCH runs dry quite soon. Aetherflow stacks are needed for Indomitability and Lustrate when solo healing, so no Energy Drain to get some MP back.

A WHM cannot DPS nonstop without going dry in a few seconds. A SCH DPS can bring full damage until their retirement pension (drains less mana than the one it consumes dpsing, loop). Burst damage, WHM has more yes, but even there, it's unreliable (what you've been complaining about SCH), because every single spell of a WHM toolkit can miss, and since you are in A3S, you should start experiencing far more misses than in A2S and in A1S (I sure do), so it's not something you can entirely neglect. As for solo healing, yes, a WHM will solo heal better...mainly because...hmmm...ask yourself this question, for the sake of balance, what should heal more, a SCH and a fairy or a WHM and a fairy?

[Adrasteia]

Even outside of Savage, SCH still rules the roost as far as DPS goes. Trying to spam Holy in a dungeon is a razor's edge struggle for most WHMs nowadays (especially since people aren't fantastically outgearing the content en masse like at the tail-end of 2.55). Shroud of Saints can barely keep up with the mana consumption of continuous Holy spam, and while the burst might be higher, the downtime's gonna be longer (or the run much less safe).

The stopgap solution is probably along the lines of lowering the mana consumption of WHM/AST DPS stuff to make it less of a dicey proposition for them, especially in harder content, but I think the better long-term solution is to find ways to improve the dynamics of healer DPS (so that smart play will let you maintain something along the current lines of SCH DPS) and, possibly, to tie DPS output in with healing (similar to the Cure proc example I mentioned on the last page). I suspect SE is nervous about tuning non-SCH healer DPS right now because of how much extra DPS that could add to current raids, which is understandable (since future planning depends on current conditions, and they've stated outright that they tune raids based on DPS simulations), but I'm hoping they'll do a comprehensive pass on it in the future.

[ckc22]

I have elaborated my points in my opening post. People disagree, I am perfectly fine with that.

But I never said that Scholar needs buffs. Again, I was talking about A3S and how, due to a series of circumstances, that fight does slightly favor the WHM toolset, in my opinion. Since A3S is pretty much all I care for atm (and since I have yet to experience A4S), yes, I am currently basing my opinion on my current endgame, which, again, is A3S. Everything else is trivial enough not to be relevant to the discussion. I do not really care if I can pull 1200 DPS in A2S. It has no relevance to A3S.

I know full well what SCH bring to a fight. As said, I have been playing it since day one. There is no need to enumerate its numerous tools, as I am perfectly familiar with them.

So you're the kind of player for who the entire game comes down to one fight. Thanks for being one of the worst parts of the community.

[DkDerek]

This always happens when an expansion comes out. Healers get used to healing a certain way at the end of an expac, because inflated gear allows them to do so. When you take away that gear, they become rather clueless.

Start of expansion healers is a whole different beast than the end of the expansion. There was no way you were spamming adlo for a crit in 2.0.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Thanks for being one of the worst parts of the community.

Wow. Ok. Way to gratuitously insult, mate. Thanks for being one of the most toxic parts of the community.

When you take away that gear, they become rather clueless.

Start of expansion healers is a whole different beast than the end of the expansion. There was no way you were spamming adlo for a crit in 2.0.

I am hardly clueless, considering I have always cleared content before nerfs/next tier of gear. Again, I was just expressing my thoughts concerning A3S. I never said SCH is not viable, nor that it is UP, nor that I am spamming Adlo hoping for a crit. I just said that Adlo is now much less powerful than how it was, due to a series of circumstances. Period.

Seriously, it appears people on this forum really enjoy bashing at others just because.

[Alahra]

I never said SCH is not viable, nor that it is UP, nor that I am spamming Adlo hoping for a crit. I just said that Adlo is now much less powerful than how it was, due to a series of circumstances. Period.

Not really period, since you implied at the end of the post that WHM was better than SCH, which colored the rest of your post as negative toward SCH. SCH is definitely on par with WHM (and arguably better), so people naturally would respond contrary to that assertion.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Not really period, since you implied at the end of the post that WHM was better than SCH, which colored the rest of your post as negative toward SCH. SCH is definitely on par with WHM (and arguably better), so people naturally would respond contrary to that assertion.

And I still believe that A3S still favors WHM slightly. As opposed to A2S, for example.
This is FAR from saying that "WHM is better than SCH". Again, my thoughts were about A3S which is currently the roadblock for most static groups.

I wonder how many of the posters here even set foot into it. Some did, I can see.