Tank DPS is the least of your issues.

[AshaCat]

First of all, you have to calm down.
Take a big breath before every answer.

Then, while if the whole party sucks the Tanks dps is irrilevant, in case of progress (No, not only First world kill) in my experience and in my static clear every bit of dps helped a lot. Yeah, even tanks and Scholar's one. Sometimes to push a phase further or to kill a trash add faster.

Obv you have to judge the enviroment. If in MY party, with MY healer the tanking part is safe then i can help with more dps. The goal of the whole thing is doing the best,pushing dps while the aggro/mitigation management is going on.

Who said I wasn't calm its just telling people to read the whole thing rather then read the first line and ignore the rest. The post he replied to wasn't actually that long. the ability of the healers largely depicts how crazy you can be as a tank to push dps but the way this community whines they feel they should all be able to do what Elysium Lucrezia etc do. Fine compare yourself to them but if your doing what the boards say your tank can do and your group just isn't winning whining the class sucks and needs more dps which is exactly what this board mainly whines about isn't really productive.

[Mattiux]

Who said I wasn't calm

Then, please, avoid some senteces.

Yeah i feel your point of view and here i think a really small part of the community aim to kill the whole Alexander Savage in the elysium time. But even the trash gate of A1S require to push some numbers from Tank and Healer. without being mad as some do, of course, but the Dps requirement is a fact.

Moreover this is a Tank sub of the forum. Here you will ever find little variety of discussion:

-Tank Dps
-Tank mitigation
-Str Vs Vit
-Please Buff *insert the tank name here*
-I hate the parry stat post

Rinse ad repeat.

[AshaCat]

Then, please, avoid some senteces.

Yeah i feel your point of view and here i think a really small part of the community aim to kill the whole Alexander Savage in the elysium time. But even the trash gate of A1S require to push some numbers from Tank and Healer. without being mad as some do, of course, but the Dps requirement is a fact.

Moreover this is a Tank sub of the forum. Here you will ever find little variety of discussion:

-Tank Dps
-Tank mitigation
-Str Vs Vit
-Please Buff *insert the tank name here*
-I hate the parry stat post

Rinse ad repeat.

It is but honestly this is the only forum I see where people whine as much as they do about "Buff pl0x, Nerf pl0x."

Repeating myself, I'm not saying Tank or Healer dps isn't required I do aim to max dps on tank while letting healers dps.... But the majority of this tanking community don't seem to consider the bigger picture and just cry "My pld should be doing the same dps war and drk do while in shield oath! Buff pl0x na0!"

[RhazeCain]

Is your raid group dieing to enrage? Yes = DPS matters, including tank DPS.

Do you like finishing your random dungeon run fast? Yes = DPS matters, including tank DPS. Sometimes I carry a DF group through expert, Warrior doing as much damage as both DPS combined in a bad case.

My group died to a2s enrage last night with last single mob at 29%. Just a little more DPS and we're there. Also, we recovered from my death at one point, so today going back with more VIT. Point being, DPS matters a lot. Usually doesn't matter who it's from, so everyone should max DPS. Depending on the situation there may be other ways to win also, but cannot overlook any aspects.

[Mattiux]

It is but honestly this is the only forum I see where people whine as much as they do about "Buff pl0x, Nerf pl0x."

Repeating myself, I'm not saying Tank or Healer dps isn't required I do aim to max dps on tank while letting healers dps.... But the majority of this tanking community don't seem to consider the bigger picture and just cry "My pld should be doing the same dps war and drk do while in shield oath! Buff pl0x na0!"

True indeed. If i remember the parser chart posted in this sub was War ~100 Drk ~950 PLD ~920. Or something like that.

imho the Dps output for every Tank class never was an issue. We can discuss ages about the utility stuff and situational skill.

obv every class have something that can be made a little "better". But without any kind of hysteria, is proven by the progress that every class can handle everything even if the skill set need some fix here and there.

[SirShuffles]

It is but honestly this is the only forum I see where people whine as much as they do about "Buff pl0x, Nerf pl0x."

Repeating myself, I'm not saying Tank or Healer dps isn't required I do aim to max dps on tank while letting healers dps.... But the majority of this tanking community don't seem to consider the bigger picture and just cry "My pld should be doing the same dps war and drk do while in shield oath! Buff pl0x na0!"

I'm guessing you haven't been to the Healer threads in awhile.

[Illya]

It is but honestly this is the only forum I see where people whine as much as they do about "Buff pl0x, Nerf pl0x."

LMAO have you literally never been to the DPS and Healer subforums or something

[Ryaz]

LMAO have you literally never been to the DPS and Healer subforums or something

Or any MMO forum ever. It's basically the same everywhere.

I'd like to do Savage one day myself, but real life takes precedence. I don't have 18 hours a day to put into a game just to clear something nor would I want to.

But as for tank DPS, the problem comes when group dps is expected to reach a certain point. I'm sure SE takes tank and healer dps into the equation when they tune these raids, which means tanks and healers can't just do their own job if they expect to clear something. Is it the good design? I don't know. It seems to put undue pressure on non-dps classes to crank out dps and the result we get is what we're seeing now. Certain classes like PLD might be the best tanks in the game-- but if it's their dps that's needed to clear content, perhaps even more so than their tanking skills, then they're at a disadvantage.

It's why I've never been a huge fan of enrage timers, even if they are a necessary evil. It forces every fight into a dps race, which means even non-dps classes need to dps and if a class is tanking just fine while putting out the best dps, chances are they're going to be the class chosen. Just like when I played The Secret Wold and everyone wanted leech healers, as they're the only healing spec that can deal damage as well.

[Kuwagami]

you could have 2 wars both doing 1k each if the rest f your raid sucks your still going to fail

I ignored the irrelevant part in your puny answer to my comment.


So, you're saying that if your raid is trash, you should be trash too and not do as best as you can ? (obvious exaggeration here, please do not quote it to insult me again)

It's not a matter of "tank dps being an issue", it's a matter of "tanks should maximize their own dps for their raid's sake". Then there is the issue you raise (aka : dps can be bad). Of course this can happen, but then you can either make them progress (show them guides, help them work their rotations, etc..) or replace them if they are no good at all (last option if everything else fails).

Also, I've yet to see people really asking for a buff/nerf (apart bards/MCH). WAR is for damage, PLD for defense, and DRK as a good compromise between both.. Nothing more to say about it

[Starkbeaumont]

i thought this thread was about bad dps, and how tanks shouldn't be foced to make up for what those are lacking