Dragoon Punished at lvl 58 - What needs to be done with Wheeling Thrust

[Fynlar]

Drgs can pretend BotD doesn't exist, just like brds that don't like WM.

Not a valid comparison. BotD works just fine UNTIL you get Wheeling Thrust, which adds complexity to the rotation for zero benefit.

BotD isn't the problem here, it's Wheeling Thrust. And once you learn it you can't just "not use it"

You aren't being punished by being forced to pay attention to receive your reward. If the two abilities were still 50/50 and one attack was better than the other, people would complain.

The attacks do the same thing, so people complain.

The attacks do the same thing therefore they have no reason to both exist. It's ability bloat, plain and simple.

Is it a weak reward? A little.. Punishment, though? Hardly.

It's not even a weak reward; that's giving it too much credit. It is *zero* reward at best, and a detriment at worst.

And for someone that has gotten very used to instinctively running to the flank for the next attack right after doing Full/Chaos, and now has to get used to NOT doing that just to fulfill an arbitrary 50/50 RNG requirement that adds nothing to my performance, that's a significant detriment.

[whiskeybravo]

It's not even a weak reward; that's giving it too much credit. It is *zero* reward at best, and a detriment at worst.

It's at least around 10% dps boost to rotation alone, not counting boost to jumps. And about a 5% loss vs old rotation if you ignore positionals. If my math is in the ballpark at least * not an expert at these things *

[karateorangutang]

It's at least around 10% dps boost to rotation alone, not counting boost to jumps. And about a 5% loss vs old rotation if you ignore positionals. If my math is in the ballpark at least * not an expert at these things *

Yes they do provide a bonus. That is true.

What he is stating though is that it is irrelevant. DRG gets that at 56, and then when they hit 58... it just makes it harder. It's opening a present at christmas from your parents then 2 hours later opening the same thing from your grandparents.

You can use it sure... but wouldnt it be better to return one and get something better and more fun?

[whiskeybravo]

Yes they do provide a bonus. That is true.

What he is stating though is that it is irrelevant. DRG gets that at 56, and then when they hit 58... it just makes it harder. It's opening a present at christmas from your parents then 2 hours later opening the same thing from your grandparents.

You can use it sure... but wouldnt it be better to return one and get something better and more fun?

You can think of it like that if you want.. I see it as my parents got me a Ferrari and my grandparents got me a Lambo. Doesn't matter which I drive I'm gonna go fast and turn heads :P

[karateorangutang]

You can think of it like that if you want.. I see it as my parents got me a Ferrari and my grandparents got me a Lambo. Doesn't matter which I drive I'm gonna go fast and turn heads :P

Honestly, I enjoy the class at 60 more than I ever did at 50. I love the random proc's and the psuedo twitch gameplay it provides. I actually even liked it better before they buffed it. It provided and sense of accomplishment I didn't get from other jobs.

But, I can understand why people are frustrated to get the same ability only with added complication at 58.

[Fynlar]

It's at least around 10% dps boost to rotation alone, not counting boost to jumps. And about a 5% loss vs old rotation if you ignore positionals. If my math is in the ballpark at least * not an expert at these things *

Yeah, and it's nothing you didn't already have at 56 before you get Wheeling Thrust.

I'm talking about specifically what you gain at 58, which is nothing except more complication.

[whiskeybravo]

Yeah, and it's nothing you didn't already have at 56 before you get Wheeling Thrust.

I'm talking about specifically what you gain at 58, which is nothing except more complication.

All of the jobs have their fair share of complexity with new rotations. The degree of complexity is subjective. But that's not what you're arguing, only that it's a "bloat" ability, and that it's apparently not rewarding. I, for one, couldn't wait to unlock Wheeling because using Fang every time got boring after 1 dungeon run.

[Fynlar]

All of the jobs have their fair share of complexity with new rotations. The degree of complexity is subjective. But that's not what you're arguing, only that it's a "bloat" ability, and that it's apparently not rewarding. I, for one, couldn't wait to unlock Wheeling because using Fang every time got boring after 1 dungeon run.

Good for you. The rest of us that are capable of measuring output will realize that this offers no benefit in output, only extra potential to screw up your output.

Added complexity is fine if you actually get rewarded somehow from it. Here it's just needless and we could have been better served with a 58 ability that actually offered something new to the job rather than just the same attack with a different animation.

[whiskeybravo]

All 4 abilities together did add something new to the job, you're breaking each one down individually and not recognizing that all 4 go together (BotD, fc, wt, and gk) as an entirely new (and interesting) mechanic. Maybe it's hard for you to see this since you're not 60 yet.. Really, if we were on the same server I'd bet you 100k gil by the time you got to 60 and start farming alex for gear you won't even remember the time you despised Wheeling thrust. There will be at least 5 other things you despise ahead of it lol

[Fynlar]

All 4 abilities together did add something new to the job, you're breaking each one down individually and not recognizing that all 4 go together (BotD, fc, wt, and gk) as an entirely new (and interesting) mechanic. Maybe it's hard for you to see this since you're not 60 yet

Go ahead, tell us what Wheeling Thrust does for the job that F&C didn't already.

Don't give me that "not 60 yet" bullcrap either, because Geirskogul does nothing to change the premise of this thread.