Astrologian "BUFFS"

[Yhisa]

I begrudgingly agree that you are right in regards to our cooldown line up. Our healing is fine but having two cooldowns with one being a stun which makes no sense to me and the other a stationary we cannot move cooldown is utterly useless outside of rp emotes. My issue is people want to change the job and duirnal and noc stances.

Yeah problem is that people want to be OP and feel strong.... AST is strong but lacks cooldowns to increase there own healing....and thus give us the idea that ast is weak because we not healing to the other healer standards

Now everyone should group up with a SCH and WHM and just heal each other WITHOUT using cooldowns and u will see that they all heal just as equally,,,,, then start to use cooldowns afterward then this is where u will see AST will fall behide hard

[WingsOfAzrael]

Yeah problem is that people want to be OP and feel strong.... AST is strong but lacks cooldowns to increase there own healing....and thus give us the idea that ast is weak because we not healing to the other healer standards

Now everyone should group up with a SCH and WHM and just heal each other WITHOUT using cooldowns and u will see that they all heal just as equally,,,,, then start to use cooldowns afterward then this is where u will see AST will fall behide hard

The fact is asts don't have nearly as many oh shit buttons as whm/scholar do, people don't want to make asts op they want to make asts balanced with whm and sch in one way or another and that includes more oh shit buttons. The fact is nocturnal stance is trash it lacks the ability to crit like scholar shields the potency is lower and it raises the overall mp cost and its virtually useless with a scholar in the party which most raid parties have end game.

You also say that the healing potency is fine, the regen potency in diurnal stance is fine but the overall heal potencies for skills are lower and the cards do not make up for that considering they're rng based any way you look at it. Also both of the other healing classes has a healing boost skill that boosts by over 10% and doesn't increase the mp cost where ast does not, that's another place they fall behind, ast has nocturnal stance, 5% boost, higher mp cost.

[kiraan]

Another problem is that they balance our skill in the fact that some of them are instant cast but the big thing is we still have to wait for the GDC after that.

Thats the main problem of lightspeed, it seems they forgot to take into account that while instant cast is nice for movement phases, it doesnt increase your healing at all because of the GCD.

[Yhisa]

The fact is asts don't have nearly as many oh shit buttons as whm/scholar do, people don't want to make asts op they want to make asts balanced with whm and sch in one way or another and that includes more oh shit buttons. The fact is nocturnal stance is trash it lacks the ability to crit like scholar shields the potency is lower and it raises the overall mp cost and its virtually useless with a scholar in the party which most raid parties have end game.

You also say that the healing potency is fine, the regen potency in diurnal stance is fine but the overall heal potencies for skills are lower and the cards do not make up for that considering they're rng based any way you look at it. Also both of the other healing classes has a healing boost skill that boosts by over 10% and doesn't increase the mp cost where ast does not, that's another place they fall behind, ast has nocturnal stance, 5% boost, higher mp cost.

the problem is that ur still comparing AST to WHM and SCH,,,, u need to stop comparing our skills to theres,, whm is the raw healing sch is the mitigation healer.... Ast is a buffer... the only difference is that we lack cooldowns to boost our own healing...... heck i did pvp last night and people couldnt kill me due to Nocturnal Sect..... me personally thing that it was made for PvP and not PvE..... i felt like god whilst healing in nocturnal sect in pvp running and throwing a shield on myself....... anyone order a slice of op pizza xD?

[Yhisa]

Every time i come to the healer forums i see players talk about stuff they barely know about...... i seen soo many ast post crap and claim we r extreamly weak when we are not i bet u 15 million gil if we had a few cooldowns that increase our healing we will be fine... but nooooo people want our cards to be mega buffed... then our potency.... then come out will silly ideas to make us op.......but this is the problem with new jobs it takes time to get it right... and in my veiw point SE have done a brilliant job with not makin this job OP ... we need tweaks yes and healing cooldowns.. but we do not need MP management or potency increase if they do that....in future we will get nerf bat...

[WingsOfAzrael]

snip

That's the point, astroloians need something to contribute sch has shields and whm has raw healing output, ast has what? cards? those aren't enough to make up for the loss of what a sch or whm could have contributed unless the party is extremely competent. And thats a thing I mentioned, they need more oh crap buttons to make them on par to sch/whm in that department, thats a major reason why people don't want asts in general when they could have a whm or a scholar in that slot who contribute more.

[Tint]

i didnt add presence of mind because it is just like Lightspeed just without the movement part it just reduce ur cast speed by a marjin like i said those was healing cooldowns that increase HEALING ,,, and there is a section at the bottem with other cooldown which i listed already u didnt read very far did u lmao

presence of mind reduce the gcd from 2,50 to 2,00. so yes, it increase my healing output. so does asylum with the HoT

[DarkmoonVael]

the problem is that ur still comparing AST to WHM and SCH,,,, u need to stop comparing our skills to theres,, whm is the raw healing sch is the mitigation healer.... Ast is a buffer... the only difference is that we lack cooldowns to boost our own healing...... heck i did pvp last night and people couldnt kill me due to Nocturnal Sect..... me personally thing that it was made for PvP and not PvE..... i felt like god whilst healing in nocturnal sect in pvp running and throwing a shield on myself....... anyone order a slice of op pizza xD?

This would be true if AST was a uniques healer in it own right. It however is not. It actually has 2 stances that are deliberately designed to mimic the other 2 healers in the game. Also, comparisons have to be made between the 3 healers when dealing with raids, you have 2 slots and 3 healers, therefor the only way to see which 2 you take is to compare the strengths and weaknesses if the 3 healers. (Which you have done to an extent in a previous post)

AST has been deliberatly designed to mimic WHM in Diurnal stance and SCH in Nocturnal stance, so my question is, why is it weird to compare ASt to the other healers when it has be designed so?

Also, it is an absolute misnomer to say (the sensible) people are wanting to make AST op. People are asking for AST to be on par with WHM and SCH. This suggests that it will be balanced with WHM and SCH.

Now in terms of actual healing, AST is still lacking, not majorly, but it needs some help. And this is not just about the raw potencies of the heals, but the actual panoply of cooldowns that go with it (if someone can not heal due to having 20 less potency on a 650 potency spell, then maybe the healing issues is not from the class). What is the issue with AST is the fact they have one emergency heal in Essential Dignity, which is a very good heal, but this alone is not good enough. If we look at WHM and SCH for comparison, they have many more (Assize, Tetragrammaton and Benediction on WHM, Lustrate, Indomnibility and Dissipation on SCH). Now what these emergency heals facilitate in raids is very major for raid progression. They allow you to recover from mistakes to push the experience of the group in the raid, allow for longer learning new raid through this, and can recover from bad situations. What it also facilitates is the stance dancing of healers in raids, allowing healers to also push dps in raids an minimising the risk of doing so. What an AST has in its move set is comoarable to WHM/SCH in 2.x, not 3.0. It needs one or two more emergency heals which help bring it on oar with WHM/SCH use in raids. At the moment, Celestial Opposition would be the best candidate to tweak to add an emergency heal element to it, as at the moment, it is probably the worst lvl60 ability in the game as it stands.

The disparity between Nocturnal sect and Diurnal sect has been brought up many many many times in these forums, but it is something that needs looking at. As it stands (and as AST has been designed), it is nigh on impossible to replace a SCH in a raid with a Nocturnal stance AST (and yes this goes back to the fact they have designed AST to mimic SCH in Nocturnal, comparisons have to be made). So, aspected Benefic is powerful in its own right, in a different manner to Adlo. Being able to move and cast a shield is powerful, but the relevance of its power is far lower than that of Adlo in a raid. Adlo strength comes from is increased shielding compared to A.benefic, as well as critadlo, and its interaction with deployment tactics. Adlo is usally used for tank busters and high amounts of damage going onto non-tanks. In these scenarios, strength of shield>ability to cast said shield whilst moving. Insta cast shields are a little too niche, and any healer worth their salt can time a shield correctly anyway, with or without a cast time.
Collective Unconcsious is flat out bad in Nocturnal, having to jepordise a healer to mitigate damage is a bad design choice. It means that this move can only really be used in boss transition phases, and not how sacred soil can be used for additional mitigation whilst pushing raid progression (think mega-flares t13 progression, if you were not targetted by it as AST, you would not be able to run in and use this move to mitigate it on other people). In Diurnal it is powerful (correct me if i am wrong, but i believe in Diurnal it turned out to be the highest potency regen in the game). However it is majorly hindered by having to channel it.

There are issues with AST that need to be addressed, many stem from the design decision to mimic the other two healers in the game rather than give us a third healer with a unique healing style.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

To me sch need a slap in the face they got way too much

Stop. Really, please stop.
Stop deliberately ignoring the fact that most of the tools SCH has are MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE as they need Aetherflow stacks. Stop assuming SCH can have Eos and Selene out at the same time.

Lustrate? No Sacred Soil, Indomitability, or Energy Drain.
Sacred Soil? No Lustrate, Indomitability or Energy Drain.
Indomitability? No Lustrate, etc.
Energy Drain? No Lustrate, etc.

Eos? No Fey Wind.
Selene? No Whispering Dawn, Fey Covenant / Illumination.

Dissipate? No fairy at all.

Please start being objective, for once. PLEASE.

[tjw]

Stop. Really, please stop.

While I do agree with on the sentiment that SCH does NOT need to be brought down, it is true that SCH has access to a vast more utility than the other two healers. And it's not the huge "I must select this ability and never use the other abilities" vibe that you seem to be putting out as a response.

Aetherflow stacks aren't rare. 3 stacks every 60 seconds. In the first place, you're not going to able to use SS or Indomitability 3 times with Aetherflow because of their cooldowns, and right now I usually use Indomitability over SS. Almost all of a SCH's 'exclusive' skills can be used together, and have great synergy with each other. And right now, Selene is used in progression more often than not. And Dissipate is only 30 seconds without a faerie, WITH an extra 3 stacks to use on 4 abilities. That still leaves SCH with Emergency and Deployment tactics, although the latter has a long cooldown.

In a typical fight, I can use an Indomitability, a Lustrate, an ED, two Emergencies and a Fey Wind every minute. That's a hell of a lotta tools compared to the other 2 healers. Does it warrant a nerf? No it doesn't. But it is one facet of a SCH's toolkit that they shine in, regardless of being behind Aetherflow stacks or not.

Both sides need to turn down a bit. Yhisa is incorrect in her overly exuberant praises of the SCH's skillset, while you're neglecting that SCH's abilities synergise very well together, and most lack the cooldown WHM and AST have on their cooldowns.

Why are we even talking about WHM and SCH's capabilities? The two 2.X healer jobs are in a comfortable position atm. We should be focusing on AST's capabilities and potential.