Master Recipe Gear OBSOLETE for RAIDS

[Alysrea]

There's nothing wrong with allowing crafters to make their own i200/i210 battle gear if they have to raid to get it (such as through an untradable boss mat) which when crafted would bind to the crafter.

While as a crafter I think the idea of making gear out of drops from raids would be amazing, I can see why SE doesn't do it because groups with crafters would basically be earning extra gear over other groups that don't have crafters throwing out their trickle progression strategy on loot lockouts they currently have :\, Its a sad it is something we will probably never see because of this fact.

[Roth_Trailfinder]

Make the crafting mat and the final piece be untradeable and unsellable.

[Snugglebutt]

I agree with SE's stance and that of many raiders prior to 3.0 which does not want crafters to craft top tier DoW/DoM gear in the first place and consider the current mid range option as the best option because it offers a market bought alternative to get people onto the bottom of the raiding ladder as opposed to completely bypassing a lot of it because bought highest tier gear from the market. I also think buying top tier gear would undermine the value of top tier raid obtained versions.

The way I see it is people should be able to gear up ready for beginning raiding through either a) maybe a mix of high level dungeon/trial grinds b) buying mid range gear via eso and upgrade that if want c) buying mid range through market board (ilvl180 fits that mid range category just fine), after which you grind the better top tier gears by taking part in the actual part of the game as will be using it in aka from the raids alone.

The only reason I can see as an excuse to let players craft top tier raid equivalent gear is pure greed. The whole idea of forcing crafters to raid to obtain the mats to make those top tier gears would not change this since if was to gear your own character you might as well grind the raids to get the highest raid obtained gear yourself anyways since you would already be raiding. The only other alternative is for the purpose of selling that overly powerful gear through the market which I am against for the reasons I stated above and SE have said their position was similar in the past regarding the selling of top tier DoW/DoM gear via crafting.

There will always be some people who want to craft the highest end raid quality style gear for selling and even some who want to use themselves but I think SE have it right with only craftable mid range gear instead. I consider the only problem with the gear at the moment to be the expense being too high on them which is a cost to craft balancing issue, other than that it is not that much different to 2.XX in you could only craft mid range gear back then too though there became an issue with p-melding making them too powerful that SE did not like happening which probably explains the ilvl difference increased from 20 to 30 due to the p-melding issues before.

[Wizarus]

But why go through the trouble of current crafting requirements when you can just get the law equivalent with far less hassle? In the end they will both be obsolete right?

[Alahra]

I'd debate that the i180 gear is even mid-range, really. Given the relative ease of gearing up through Law/Hunts combined with weekly runs of i190 Alexander, the i180 gear isn't particularly useful even for that, at least with how restricted the supply of them will be thanks to the weekly gating and the high scarcity for the materials. When you also consider the need for materia melds for the gear to really make it worthwhile, it's value comes into question even further.

Personally, I think they would have done better to make the gear i190 but limit materia melds on them in some way, either by removing a secondary stat (as they had done with the crafted jewelry) or not allowing melds on them at all.

[Snugglebutt]

But why go through the trouble of current crafting requirements when you can just get the law equivalent with far less hassle? In the end they will both be obsolete right?

In which case if feel like it is less hassle way to gear up your DoW/DoM through law (ilvl170 upgraded through hunts to ilvl180) rather than crafting your DoW/DoM gear then gain your own set through law/hunts, craft the marketable version for generating income selling to people who do not want to grind law and hunts which would be more hassle for them than buying one of the market board.

Same way it generally worked in 2.XX when people were buying the mid range crafted gear or grinding soldier/poetics etc as an alternative for roughly same ilvl gear that could be crafted. Using that gear then to take part in the raids and grind better raid gear through raiding. In my opinion is not the ilvl of the gear that is the issue since it is not that far off the 2.XX ilvl gap used to be back then between crafted and raid obtained gear. It was minus 20 ilvls back then and it's only minus 30 now which is not a huge difference. The principle is the same as back then as it is now, they just happened to mess up the crafting cost/requirements this time around.

I'd debate that the i180 gear is even mid-range, really. Given the relative ease of gearing up through Law/Hunts combined with weekly runs of i190 Alexander...

Alexander ilvl190 is still raid obtained gear, it should be an upgrade to the law/hunt based and crafting based ilvl180 versions. You tend to get ilvl160-170 through dungeon drops, you can then upgrade to ilvl180 through law/hunt or crafting which leads to raiding and obtaining 190+. The only issue is it is currently not profitable to craft the ilvl180 the market board version and that needs to be fixed. Sorry if you want to craft ilvl200/210 etc type gear but I don't see that happening and for good reason, those reasons that have been inline with SE's stance on the issue even before 3.0 came along to which I agree with SE as did many raiders prior to 3.0. You can't please everyone but SE has made their stance on this issue known for a very long time so you really shouldn't be surprised by it.

[ckc22]

snip

Crafting powerful gear worked perfectly fine in XI. This is just a symptom of Yoshi-p's World of Fantasycraft hardon for raids.

[Alahra]

Crafting powerful gear worked perfectly fine in XI. This is just a symptom of Yoshi-p's World of Fantasycraft hardon for raids.

It also worked nearly perfectly fine for all of ARR. It only really became an issue for FCOB and I'd wager that was more because so much of the i130 gear was rather poorly itemized than it was that the crafted gear was too good. It took millions upon millions of gil to make the 110 gear equal to the 130 gear (since it nearly always required multiple Tier IV advanced melds). They could have addressed the general problem through materia and kept the gear at the 20-item-level deficit and made the gear still worthwhile for catch up gear, I think. As is now, it's not really worth it for that either.

[scarebearz]

The thing is, the crafted gear is a lot weaker than 2.x, but it's literally dozens of times harder to get the mats for.

I think the ilvl on the near gear is fine, it's a light upgrade from Law gear.

The problem is the scrips/mats weekly cap and insane grind.

[Alahra]

The thing is, the crafted gear is a lot weaker than 2.x, but it's literally dozens of times harder to get the mats for.

I think the ilvl on the near gear is fine, it's a light upgrade from Law gear.

The problem is the scrips/mats weekly cap and insane grind.

Yes, the item level would be fine as is if it weren't so hard to get. With how restricted everything is, they should probably be i190 at a minimum, though. No one is going to pay enough for i180 gear to make up for all the time/money invested by crafters that can make it.