When Friends, or you, become an Elitist.

[scarebearz]

I'm referring to those people who have a sense of entitlement

There should be a name for people who go around the forums saying everything is "entitlement". xD

I think crafters are more elitist than anyone, even if I bring all the mats and shards with the request of normal quality they want an absurd amount of gil. Least by the definition of wanting to be rewarded for everything :P

Well if the craft you wanted is something like the Thav Dress, where the mats were costing something like 10mil+ to make and the crafted has to unlocked master book 3 to make them and gear up some, you should expect to pay a price proportionate to the cost of mats and MB value of the finished item. In the above example a crafter asking 500k for the craft would very reasonable in my opinion.

Far too many people think crafters magically unlock recipes and gear up without it costing anything (8 crafts geared and master books unlocked in 3.0 cost me around 120mil), so you should be able to tip them 5k for the highest tier crafts, this is not the case.

[AlphaFox]

Well if the craft you wanted is something like the Thav Dress, where the mats were costing something like 10mil+ to make and the crafted has to unlocked master book 3 to make them and gear up some, you should expect to pay a price proportionate to the cost of mats and MB value of the finished item. In the above example a crafter asking 500k for the craft would very reasonable in my opinion.

Far too many people think crafters magically unlock recipes and gear up without it costing anything (8 crafts geared and master books unlocked in 3.0 cost me around 120mil), so you should be able to tip them 5k for the highest tier crafts, this is not the case.

I am a crafter myself but if I bring items for the sake of building my airship and just cant easily make, or for the sake of not having the class leveled enough, I think a few 1000 gil is a good compensation, not frowning cus you wanted 10k+

[MeiUshu]

There should be a name for people who go around the forums saying everything is "entitlement". xD



Well if the craft you wanted is something like the Thav Dress, where the mats were costing something like 10mil+ to make and the crafted has to unlocked master book 3 to make them and gear up some, you should expect to pay a price proportionate to the cost of mats and MB value of the finished item. In the above example a crafter asking 500k for the craft would very reasonable in my opinion.

Far too many people think crafters magically unlock recipes and gear up without it costing anything (8 crafts geared and master books unlocked in 3.0 cost me around 120mil), so you should be able to tip them 5k for the highest tier crafts, this is not the case.

this is probably the most silly answer I have seen and read. If you decided to unlock a book 3 is your decision because you wanted it, wished it and desired it. I dont think that building a stuff that you do not have to put forth any effort other then beat on a hammer or needle or whatever, and asking INSANE amount of gils for that is just being greedy is all and people that pay for that are as silly, but then they have no choice other then pay if they want their stuff, it sounds like is a sort of blackmail is like to say *I can, you cant, if you want it you pay or go to hell* this kind of mentality is just unbelievable, especially if it is asked for something very specific.

It doesnt mean that because you can you should

Mei

[tjw]

snip

You know, this makes me question what kind of society you grew up in that you can point the finger at someone rendering you a service and blame them for your own incompetence 'because it's your decision to service me!'. PLENTY of people decide to advance, to push beyond the norm. That's what college and university is for. That's what academies for all different professions are there for. Do you think attending these institutes is just a walk in the park? No. You need to put the effort into learning. You need to pay. You need to sacrifice time to get that far.

And what is the end result they all strive for? TO MAKE MORE MONEY. To be above the norm, so they can be fulfilled when they are willing to put their services to use. Let us not forget that it's YOU as a consumer who WANTS their services and products. YOU want the high-end goods and services, YOU want luxuy, YOU want to be that special snowflake, but YOU aren't willing to put in that effort they did.

Why do you think a fast food burger is cheaper than a plate of wagyu beef with sides? Why do you think renting a room in an alley-way motel is cheaper than staying in the Four Seasons? Why do you think government lawyer attorneys seem to be worse than private lawyer corporations attorneys? Why do you think private schools charge so much for a number and a piece of paper at the end of a student's time?

Yes, crafting and gathering in-game is vastly different from an actual profession in the real world. But it's not just "beat on a hammer or needle or whatever", which is what YOU see. Would YOU question the chef of the high-ranked restaurant, "Oh, all you did was smack on a piece of beef on the grill and put it on the plate!"? Would YOU go up to a hotel manager and berate them stating, "All you do is change bedsheets and charge exuberant prices on a Mars bar!"? Would you complain to a teacher that, "You just sit there and mark papers!"?

Because that's all YOU see as a consumer. YOU don't see the chef slave for years training at numerous cooking academies, suffering scathing remarks and burnt fingers. YOU don't see the hotel manager working up from being just a loader, and studying his Retail degree in order to work at such a position. YOU don't see the lawyer and teacher going to post-graduate studies to obtain even higher qualifications, paying for their time at the universities.

Just as YOU don't see the crafter behind the screen of their computer spending their time on levelling and gearing their crafting jobs to 60. Just as YOU don't see the crafter desperately fight on the markets for expensive materials or spend time and effort in farming which requires more effort spent on a battle or gathering class. Just as YOU don't see them exasperated at having missed that one hour in-game slot to get an item, or botch their 6th synthesis in a row due to RNG.

No, all YOU see is them "beat on a hammer or needle or whatever" and an item comes out. And guess what? Even after all the explanation I've done, I doubt that YOU, as a consumer, even care. All YOU care about is getting what you want, at the lowest possible burden, resources and effort that you can expend. And I do not blame you for that, for it is the nature of a consumer. It's in the way you respect such a service or profession that separates you from a bad consumer and a good one.

Regardless to say, your behaviour is very childish and close-minded. Just as you said that just because they can put things at a higher price they feel reflects their effort and their expectations of being rewarded for such effort, you don't need to, on the CONSUMER side i.e. YOU, just because you want it doesn't mean you need it.

You call her answer silly. I call your reply sillier, even pathetic.

This is going into grounds that can't be napkin-mathed out, or be entirely quantified. I'll almost say this is a mix of a "Tragedy of the commons" and the "Everyone wants better, No One wants change" attitude that is prevalent amongst the common crowd nowadays. Someone more experienced in such areas of psychology would no doubt be better than me at explaining.

Just to clarify; I am not a crafter, nor am I a gatherer. On my main character, I barely broke 3 mil gil atm. However, I can see the effort that numerous of my FC mates are putting into their crafting and gathering classes, and I respect them for their dedication. That you can insult their dedication and effort and dismiss it as something common makes me mounmentally outraged, and apathetic to your opinion.

[Sakuraluna]

Snippety snip snip.

That person was replying to a crafter who replied to this:

I think crafters are more elitist than anyone, even if I bring all the mats and shards with the request of normal quality they want an absurd amount of gil. Least by the definition of wanting to be rewarded for everything :P

by calculating the price of mats into an item anyways and then stating that they should expect to be charged as such regardless of having already paid for/gathered up the mats themselves. And to that, yes, it's a silly demand. I don't mind tipping generously because I do respect the amount of work people put into leveling and gearing up their crafters, but I'm not about to be double-charged for something.

[ServerCollaps]

this is probably the most silly answer I have seen and read. If you decided to unlock a book 3 is your decision because you wanted it, wished it and desired it. I dont think that building a stuff that you do not have to put forth any effort other then beat on a hammer or needle or whatever, and asking INSANE amount of gils for that is just being greedy is all and people that pay for that are as silly, but then they have no choice other then pay if they want their stuff, it sounds like is a sort of blackmail is like to say *I can, you cant, if you want it you pay or go to hell* this kind of mentality is just unbelievable, especially if it is asked for something very specific.

It doesnt mean that because you can you should

Mei

and because of his "sillyness" he got all the upvotes and you didnt

[scarebearz]

this is probably the most silly answer I have seen and read. If you decided to unlock a book 3 is your decision because you wanted it, wished it and desired it. I dont think that building a stuff that you do not have to put forth any effort other then beat on a hammer or needle or whatever, and asking INSANE amount of gils for that is just being greedy is all and people that pay for that are as silly, but then they have no choice other then pay if they want their stuff, it sounds like is a sort of blackmail is like to say *I can, you cant, if you want it you pay or go to hell* this kind of mentality is just unbelievable, especially if it is asked for something very specific.

It doesnt mean that because you can you should

Mei

Most "high-end" crafters unlock master books at great expence to themselves, in order to hopefully make back more gil in the long run. Surely anyone can understand this logic.

We do not do it so that we can then go around crafting everything for free, for random players who are too mean to even pay a 5% tip on the mats cost (as per my example, that you call "greedy" and "insane").

If everyone did as you suggest there would be no "high-end" crafters, as none of us could ever afford to level/unlock them.

You appear to be one of those players that expect everyone else to do everything you wish, without ever doing anything in return, yet your calling me Greedy xD

I find your mentality to be unbelieveable too ^^



P.S. I have only ever had 1 person say my crafting fee's were unreasonable, I offered to sell him the finished item at a very reduced rate or if he provided the mats I would make it free. It turns out that offering to craft with someones mats *for free* is unreasonable, as I should make it with my own mats and give the item away free. Maybe you would have taken his side Mei? xD Needless to say, this person is now on my blist...

[MeiUshu]

Most "high-end" crafters unlock master books at great expence to themselves, in order to hopefully make back more gil in the long run. Surely anyone can understand this logic.

We do not do it so that we can then go around crafting everything for free, for random players who are too mean to even pay a 5% tip on the mats cost (as per my example, that you call "greedy" and "insane").

If everyone did as you suggest there would be no "high-end" crafters, as none of us could ever afford to level/unlock them.

You appear to be one of those players that expect everyone else to do everything you wish, without ever doing anything in return, yet your calling me Greedy xD

I find your mentality to be unbelieveable too ^^



P.S. I have only ever had 1 person say my crafting fee's were unreasonable, I offered to sell him the finished item at a very reduced rate or if he provided the mats I would make it free. It turns out that offering to craft with someones mats *for free* is unreasonable, as I should make it with my own mats and give the item away free. Maybe you would have taken his side Mei? xD Needless to say, this person is now on my blist...

The argument you give as a reason to allow HIGH prices of market is totally silly and I will repeat that to the end, what you choosed to do is no one business and is not acceptable as a reason for inflating the prices and* kill* those that want or just need something because they cant build it themselves.

For your information, I do everything myself..eh? Including undercutting by alot those that I consider thieves.

This is a game, not a life job that you need money in order to live.

Mei

[scarebearz]

The argument you give as a reason to allow HIGH prices of market is totally silly and I will repeat that to the end, what you choosed to do is no one business and is not acceptable as a reason for inflating the prices and* kill* those that want or just need something because they cant build it themselves.

For your information, I do everything myself..eh? Including undercutting by alot those that I consider thieves.

This is a game, not a life job that you need money in order to live.

Mei

So if Thavarian Silk cost 5mil each and you need 3 to make a robe, you'll sell the finished robe on the MB for 1mil, because anything more is too high?

Or someone who has just bought the mats for 15mil off the MB, you'll craft it for them (after spending millions gearing crafters) for a like 5k?

Yeah sure...

I guess it's easy to talk like this when you don't even have 1 craft at lvl50 >.<