What's the point of being elite at your job?

[Outfoxed]

You are wrong. Elite players in MMORPG separate themselves by a perfect knowledge of boss and enemies paterns for PVE, and by skill and knowledge of all classes in PVP.

Now you put yourself in PVE context, and try to compare your skill to anyone else. Sure, hitting an optimal DPS is "easy" for everyone by reading guide and everything, but being able to deal your optimal DPS while applying boss strategy perfectly to make your tank/heal job easier is totally different.

Compare what can be compared first.

Sry for my spelling.

"Perfect knowledge of boss and enemies patterns for PVE"

Any clown can spend an hour studying a book to know when Nael Deus Darnus decides to blink. I hardly get how that makes them elite.


Skill requirement != time requirement.

Knowing what a boss is going to do at every single second isn't skillful, it's just plain memorization. It's like doing a math test. You can a) memorize all the answers or b) actually know what you're doing. If you're dodging a bosses move before he actually uses his skill then I question the design of your game. That's like breaking into a safe when someone tells you the combination. You don't need to be an expert safecracker, you just have to have minimal brain functions.

[Skullhack]

Any clown can spend an hour studying a book to know when Nael Deus Darnus decides to blink. I hardly get how that makes them elite.


Skill requirement != time requirement.

Ok I repeat myself : PVE require 0 skill other than being able to dodge a big red circle that pop under your feet. It's all about knowledge and reaction to a situation you memorized because it's the only way to not give the ground a big kiss.

LoL is PVP, skill and a little of strategy (or just playing the op champ of the patch). FFXIV PVE is... PVE, yes. It's knowledge and positionning. If you want skill, go PVP.

Have you ever played WoW PVE btw ? It's exactly the same. Tell me one MMORPG that separate elite from beginers IN PVE BY THEIR SKILL.

[Skullhack]

Have you ever played WoW PVE btw ? It's exactly the same. Tell me one MMORPG that separate elite from beginers IN PVE BY THEIR SKILL.

So, no answer ?

After thinking about it : you are playing against AI and you can learn their pattern. On LoL, you are playing against other player, you can't learn their pattern, that's why there is no way to compare.

Now if you want skill in PVE, go play Monster Hunter, it require more skill than being Challenger on LoL.

[Tila]

"Perfect knowledge of boss and enemies patterns for PVE"

Any clown can spend an hour studying a book to know when Nael Deus Darnus decides to blink. I hardly get how that makes them elite.


Skill requirement != time requirement.

Knowing what a boss is going to do at every single second isn't skillful, it's just plain memorization. It's like doing a math test. You can a) memorize all the answers or b) actually know what you're doing. If you're dodging a bosses move before he actually uses his skill then I question the design of your game. That's like breaking into a safe when someone tells you the combination. You don't need to be an expert safecracker, you just have to have minimal brain functions.

Many would argue that the key to being skillful at MOBA is mostly knowing what others can do and how to react to it. IE: its a time requirement of how fast you can memorize things.

[Outfoxed]

Many would argue that the key to being skillful at MOBA is mostly knowing what others can do and how to react to it. IE: its a time requirement of how fast you can memorize things.

There's the time requirement there. But your skill matters a lot. It's not exactly a hard concept to last hit minions for example. But a good player will double a silver players CS any day of the week. There really isn't much of a knowledge requirement for CS aside from the fact that towers do ~45% of a melee minions health and maybe 75% of a ranged minions health. Not exactly a huge knowledge requirement to know what your opponents QWE are, hell you can google it before the match and know what they're going to throw at you. But the best players come out of that trade with a couple autoattacks more or get more minion damage out of their fight. A diamond player in a mirror matchup (basically adjusting for champion knowledge) against a silver will win 90% of the time.

A good player presented with the same knowledge as a bad player results in two different things. The bronze player will know what skills his opponent has but the diamond player will know what skills his opponents has AND how he will deal with it, how he will deal with any potential issues. The diamond player just reacts to the knowledge better than the bronze player because he knows how to apply it. So a bronze player might know that Tristanas E at level 1 did 110 base damage at level 1. But the diamond player is the one who will actively try to trade with that 110 base damage E because he knows he has an advantage and he pushes to abuse it.

[Tila]

There's the time requirement there. But your skill matters a lot. It's not exactly a hard concept to last hit minions for example. But a good player will double a silver players CS any day of the week. There really isn't much of a knowledge requirement for CS aside from the fact that towers do ~45% of a melee minions health and maybe 75% of a ranged minions health. Not exactly a huge knowledge requirement to know what your opponents QWE are, hell you can google it before the match and know what they're going to throw at you. But the best players come out of that trade with a couple autoattacks more or get more minion damage out of their fight. A diamond player in a mirror matchup (basically adjusting for champion knowledge) against a silver will win 90% of the time.

My point is that the biggest divider between players is knowing how to properly react to other players: their items, their skills, how those skills synergize with others. Yes, there are even more little minor things above that that seperate elite from super elite, but you have that in FFXIV too. Hell, the monk thread is currently discussing the validity of using fracture and the exact moments you should use it. Its all about memorization and knowledge of fights. MOBAs are a good deal about memorizing and having knowledge of heroes and items.