We should have a "Lance mage", "Ninja Sword mage", "Fist mage"

[Wintersandman]

Bards get a double dose of this basically with Bloodletter proc's and Straight Shot proc's.

Bloodletter being different, but very comparable situation though.

BLM's have a double dose as well with Thundercloud (which is now useless) and Firestarter procs. Thundercloud works like Bloodletter and Firestarter like Straight Shot. But BLM's don't have the luxury have being able to use Thundercloud procs off the GCD and even if they could they would be unable to due to their 2.5 minimum cast timer.

[Snowaeth]

BLM's have a double dose as well with Thundercloud (which is now useless) and Firestarter procs. Thundercloud works like Bloodletter and Firestarter like Straight Shot. But BLM's don't have the luxury have being able to use Thundercloud procs off the GCD and even if they could they would be unable to due to their 2.5 minimum cast timer.

Well from what you describe you sound like you agree about how fun of a mechanic it is right?

Thunder proc's don't cut into BLM GCD, they take up the GCD for a (what used to be high potency attack) and added mobility, while happening quite rarely, not so much as throwing rotations off as fitting into rotations (Pre 3.0)
I understand how it's bad for 3.0 but it's been admitted to be bad and I'm pretty sure Yoshi already mentioned they'r fixing thunder in 3.0.

On a bard Bloodletter proc's happen about once every 7ish sec, they are OGCD so you still need to combine it with the cast of a GCD, meaning they don't really give you mobility without dps loss and because of the rate they can happen at it forces you to use them asap, pushing other ogcd's and now even GCD's because BL can proc during casts.

[Johaan]

No, that's not what Bards are complaining about at all.

That's what non-Bards try to boil the complaints down to because they don't know what they're talking about.

been following all these "brds" threads, and some brds want competitive dps, some want mobility others want more utility, and some want everything, so yes from an outsider perspective you guys are all over the place.


just because a few agree with you does not speak for all brds and what they want.

[Dante_V]

been following all this "brds" threads, and some brds want competitive dps, some want mobility others want more utility, and some want everything, so yes from an outsider perspective you guys are all over the place.


just because a few agree with does not speak for all brds and what they want.

Have read a lot of these threads and agree with this 100%.

[Aiselia]

you guys are all over the place.

Do I have to go through the importance of putting a limit on the scope of a statement when summarizing a group's position again?

Very well.

Adam likes anchovies, but hates beef and chicken.
Ben likes beef, but hates chicken and anchovies.
Charles likes chicken, but hates anchovies and beef.
Dan is a glutton and loves all three.

Adam, Ben, Charles, and Dan are all men.
The statement "Men like beef" is technically correct because Ben and Dan are men and like beef. However, it is misleading and an inaccurate summary of the situation because Adam and Charles are also men but don't like beef.

Can you figure out how this applies?

"Some bards" wanting more damage, "some bards" wanting 100% mobility with the damage, and "some bards" wanting more utility is inaccurately summed up as "Bards want more damage, 100% mobility, and more utility."

[YanderePrincess]

It wouldn't 'change dragoon completely.' It would simply not make sense. With how bows actually work, it actually does make a certain amount of sense on Bard. Same for Machinist, if you look at it as taking the time to aim more precisely. And as someone who mains Black Mage in addition to dragoon, SUCK IT UP.

[Wintersandman]

Well from what you describe you sound like you agree about how fun of a mechanic it is right?

I am more just saying welcome to the new world. Not saying things shouldn't change for QoL but the only change request I have seen is about WM and complaints about WM. In reality you're just getting affected by what other classes have felt for months/years. One key difference between the two is bloodletter has a CD where thunder and Fire III do not. BLM loses their freebie where as Bard delays another potential reset.

It looks like some creative problem solving needs to happen and it can't start with throw out WM.

Horrible Analogy

What he is saying is you guys need to come together with a united message on what you want. If you want change, the bard community can't be all over the place.

Because Adam, Ben, Charles and Dan do like to eat something that is similar. Find out what the similarity is perhaps Turkey or Pork.

[Snowaeth]

I am more just saying welcome to the new world. Not saying things shouldn't change for QoL but the only change request I have seen is about WM and complaints about WM. In reality you're just getting affected by what other classes have felt for months/years. One key difference between the two is bloodletter has a CD where thunder and Fire III do not. BLM loses their freebie where as Bard delays another potential reset.

It looks like some creative problem solving needs to happen and it can't start with throw out WM.

What he is saying is you guys need to come together with a united message on what you want. If you want change, the bard community can't be all over the place.

Because Adam, Ben, Charles and Dan do like to eat something that is similar. Find out what the similar is perhaps Turkey or Pork.

And that's exactly what I've been trying to do in my thread already
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-how-to-fix-it.

It is however hard to unite bards, because there are different issues for each one of them.
I mean I'm focusing on how to fix things within WM, but obviously there are plenty of bards that don't want to accept WM at all and what not.
I can't blame them, but saying remove WM doesn't offer a good basis for discussing issues with what we already have as this requires to meet a new condition first before we can even discuss how to fix the state that would come out of it.

[Aiselia]

What he is saying is you guys need to come together with a united message on what you want. If you want change, the bard community can't be all over the place.

Which is difficult to do if people don't want the same things.

This may come as a surprise to you, but members of a group are allowed to disagree with other members of the same group.

And that will be the last response I grace you with, because I'm sure you'll ignore what I say anyways.

[pandabearcat]

So I guess you agree bards all want different things?

Which means this current incarnation may be just what some bards want?

Which means some of you may have to just "suck it up" as it were.