When would you take DRK over PLD or WAR?

[Hydrium]

When the person who's playing tank wants to be one. If they are good enough it won't matter which tank they pick. Personally as a raid leader so long as it wasn't two drks I wouldn't care. I would however be more inclined to push for a dark knight if there wasn't a monk in the group to get the int debuff. But honestly the jobs in this game are homogenized enough that it really doesn't make a difference and at this point drks seem to make up 60% of the end game tanking population and I've cleared loads of content with them. If your team is failing because of the tank job your tank is running there is probably a bigger issue.

Pretty much this, except for the highest ends of raiding that are pushing for firsts this is a non-issue. DRK has some issues to be sure but ever speck of content can be cleared using them with no hassle.

[Delily]

All these super long posts with theory crafting and weighty sounding opinions.

You bring a drk over the other two when one joins your pf. When one fits your raid schedule. When your long time in\game tank friend wants to play it instead of the other two. When content is on farm and you dont need the extra mitigation of a pld.

SE tests these classes in the content they provide. With actual info, concrete numbers and not reverse engineered fudgy ones. Im not saying SE is perfect. But itd be daft to think they created a class without proof they can make it through the content.

This is the correct answer. Unless you're cutting content to be a world first, being 100% optimal is not needed. There expression "perfect is the enemy of good" comes to mind.

[Mclyde]

Average players really need optimization to succeed at doing something you know.

[Ditto]

There are 3 tanks in the game.

You keep comparingyourself to one of them. Paladins make due and have no real source of tp regen. They also cannot weave in unmend for some continued offense or anything of the sort. You seem hung up on being great off tanks--re roll as a warrior. They excel at it. A dark knight is not as good as a war--but you parse higher than paladins do at the moment, so that is a choice you make.

Not every class (certainly tanks) get tp management. Get used to asking for goad and bards like paladins have been since the dawn of time (or in one case--the dawn of ninjas!).

I compare to other tanks because that is the only thing to compare them to. And that 3rd tank is US.

Paladins have ways to delay their TP decay. Shield Swipe, and their other casted abilities now. They're in the same boat with a Defiance warrior in that they have enough GCD abilities, or casts in their case now, that offers more time for them to regen TP.

In a Pld's case, group support or swipe procs (Which you seem to be forgetting about).

In a Wars case, high damage at only the cost of Wrath. Those kind of things do make a difference.

And it was less for the point of comparison, and more for the point of describing how fast they could burn their TP.

[Faytte]

I compare to other tanks because that is the only thing to compare them to. And that 3rd tank is US.

Paladins have ways to delay their TP decay. Shield Swipe, and their other casted abilities now. They're in the same boat with a Defiance warrior in that they have enough GCD abilities, or casts in their case now, that offers more time for them to regen TP.

In a Pld's case, group support or swipe procs (Which you seem to be forgetting about).

In a Wars case, high damage at only the cost of Wrath. Those kind of things do make a difference.

And it was less for the point of comparison, and more for the point of describing how fast they could burn their TP.

Shield Swipe regens a massive 10 tp every time you use it. Only works when you are MT. You do not get THAT many casts off, (either as MT as they can be interupted very easily in raids, or OT because by the time you finish a clemency cast --the target has been filled up on HP by other tanks). It is also flat out not great---using it means your goring blade or rage debuffs will fall off, and you are doing much better damage simply doing your RA combo. It's not without purpose, but you dont just smack it cause the button lights up (infact--you very seldomly smack it at all) If you are running out of tp--you are better served just not hitting a buttons to regen tp to throw at another combo since they all have better returns on damage (both as combo averages as well as potency to combo ratio).

If you want a point of comparison, you can spam unmake --it costs mana and does a healthy 150 potency, during which time you will regen quite a bit more than shield swipe. While shield swipe hits for an extra 60 potency, it also only can be used while tanking. A DRK can manage their tp /while/ dpsing as an OT. The only way a Paladin can is by stopping to dps every once in a while to cast a slow 3 second cast, generally for little good because it all becomes overhealing (unless say, a healer is dead).

DRK have tp management, you just arnt using it correctly. You have tons of excess mana, and your unmake at 150 is nothing to sneeze at, since you are regening 100% tp for that spent GCD.

[Phoenicia]

*snip*

If you want a point of comparison, you can spam unmake --it costs mana and does a healthy 150 potency, during which time you will regen quite a bit more than shield swipe. While shield swipe hits for an extra 60 potency, it also only can be used while tanking. A DRK can manage their tp /while/ dpsing as an OT. The only way a Paladin can is by stopping to dps every once in a while to cast a slow 3 second cast, generally for little good because it all becomes overhealing (unless say, a healer is dead).

DRK have tp management, you just arnt using it correctly. You have tons of excess mana, and your unmake at 150 is nothing to sneeze at, since you are regening 100% tp for that spent GCD.

Let's not forget a PLD that's casting isn't going to auto-attack, which is a huge portion of their Sword Oath DPS. Merely standing there auto-attacking and waiting for TP to regain is BETTER than casting Stoneskin or what-have-you.

[Faytte]

Yep...as a MT

Casting a spell means no auto threat generation, no shield blocking or parry. Its a LONG spell and easy to interrupt.
As an OT, most of the time the spell ends up being 80% over healing cause healers are far far faster, and you are not dpsing.

Dark knight can use unmake for 150 potency, spam it, still be attacking (since its 'instant') and regen a full gcd worth of tp during that time period. Thats far superior as MT or OT to say, shield swipe (the amount of tp you gain vs the damage (free for 150, or 40 for 210).

[MythToken]

I would take a DRK over the other two tanks, when the player playing the DRK is good.

Player skill > class

[Faytte]

I would take a DRK over the other two tanks, when the player playing the DRK is good.

Player skill > class

Why?

I see this argument, but do not understand it. Can you expand on why you think this?

[Einherei]

this topic is about when would you take a drk over a pld or war.
MythToken view is that they believe player skill > class.
They answered the topic with their own answer, from their own personal view they believe skill is more important.
There is no room to expand on a person personal view point.