Bard - they broke my job

[ChloeGrace]

-snip-

Your archer is 14. You don't even have the job unlocked.
No wonder it sounds like you're talking out your a**.
Go level it up and gain some insight into the mechanics of the job, THEN post.

[Arrik]

You are a support job, the old Healing LB was a big hint at this. If you think you are just another DPS, think again.

The old LB was a holdover from their support status in 1.0, which went away with the conjurer sub. It's not really surprising that they didn't want to make a new LB just for brd when all the others within a role shared the same one. And they changed it with the inclusion of another job that would potentially use a ranged dps LB.

Face it, other dps jobs support the team for like what ? 15 sec ? Mantra (Monk) / Crit buff (Drg) etc ? That's far from what BRDs can bring to the table.

All of said buffs suffer no hinderance from being rotated (4 drgs have no problem rotating keeping crit buffs up over half the time, same w/ nin and TA). If you have 4 Brds in party, most utility goes out the window. Not to mention that with the exception of Foe's we have a damage penalty built into the songs. Better buff, more risk while using it. Still doesn't excuse the base dps loss compared to other ranged dps.

Not to mention mages like WHM / AST need a stance to DPS, and they also lose something for that : their Healing power

So do we, and we lose mobility.

You have a spot in most raids just because of this, and you curse it ?

We have a spot, any other dps in the roster could have up to 3.

I'd remove songs altogether, and give those to another job, I bet BRDs would whine even more, no ?

I'd love to be a Ranger, why thank you.

[LambLich]

Snippy

Be easier to break the class in half and give people ranger and bard. I dont see how "support" dps can ever be truly balanced within the system they want to use to define partys. Being a glorified battery is great and all well and good until you stick 4 glorified batterys into one group expect it to somehow perform anywhere close to as well as so called "pure dps".

[Arrik]

Be easier to break the class in half and give people ranger and bard. I dont see how "support" dps can ever be truly balanced within the system they want to use to define partys. Being a glorified battery is great and all well and good until you stick 4 glorified batterys into one group expect it to somehow perform anywhere close to as well as so called "pure dps".

This might be the best way tbh. To add to this, I've played quite a few games where Bard was a full healer and it was a lot of fun. Songs that stack HoTs, tons of buffs, etc.

[KisaMystfell]

I understand the debate of Bard a 'support' vs 'dps 1st'. Not fussed about that. If you play Bard right, then you can pump out great damage whilst providing great support and utility. What DOES set Bard apart is that, ontop of the utility, we have freedom of movement. Songs and movement are what makes us more unique to the 'pure dps' classes out there. What grinds my nugget is that Bard is being forced into Minuet whether you like it or not; if you don't, you lose a hefty bonus to dps. LUCKILY the most recent change means the instant cast can now be spammed to Ishgard and back.
Eg Minuet up, pump out dps. Got an aoe inc? Unpop Minuet, move whilst autoattacking, once you're safe, pop Minuet.
Still a bit wizard ranger for me, but let's make the best of a cruddy situation.
Note, our songs are not hindered by Minuet, folks. We can sing til the primals come home.
I was upset about Minuet existing when it was first announced, but nobody likes change to their beloved classes.
/soothe

[Snugglebutt]

What DOES set Bard apart is that, ontop of the utility, we have freedom of movement. Songs and movement are what makes us more unique to the 'pure dps' classes out there. What grinds my nugget is that Bard is being forced into Minuet whether you like it or not; if you don't, you lose a hefty bonus to dps. LUCKILY the most recent change means the instant cast can now be spammed to Ishgard and back

You can't do that though, with the inclusion of the 15 second cooldown you will end up without the DPS buff WM provides for 15 seconds whether your out of danger or not.

[Snugglebutt]

Be easier to break the class in half and give people ranger and bard. I dont see how "support" dps can ever be truly balanced within the system they want to use to define partys. Being a glorified battery is great and all well and good until you stick 4 glorified batterys into one group expect it to somehow perform anywhere close to as well as so called "pure dps".

I agree with this, whenever there is more than one bard or bard/machinist in single party I know it is often just matter of time before other members whine about the DPS output and hitting DPS checks just because of the presence of more than one of them in the group. If have more than one bard in a group and the group fails a DPS check, regardless of if the bards performed very well they will be the ones blamed and insulted, one or both kicked or ends in a vote abandon. This might not be as big a problem in PF or statics but it is a major problem in DF plus you still get PF groups who exclude bards and machinists just because of the class and not ability to play it far too often. It's becoming very annoying as a person who mains a bard.

[MercureXI]

Go level it up and gain some insight into the mechanics of the job, THEN post.

Yeah because playing Bard will get me to understand basic mechanics a lot better and why you seem to fail at giving any type of valid argument here ?

I can talk about all mechanics in the game, it has nothing to do with "levelling a class to 60" ... how dense are you really ?

Wanna talk about the fact that you aren't BRD 60, didn't clear Ravana EX or Alexander yet ? Now who has no experience ? Certainly not me ... I play with BRDs 60 from FC during those events and saw them perform, you just come here to bitch for no reason.

Can't talk about the fact that AST's RNG based cards require adjustements because my AST is 41 ?

BRDs whine all the time ... over nothing usually, and here it's all the same : you gain a dps boost that requires a static position, you whine. You would have had side / back positioning, it would have been the same.

What you want, is an easy DPS class, with no penalty (ever), and still be top tier DPS, while being highly desired for being the best utility DPS (even though you curse it for some reason).

Sorry, can't have that for now. Deal with it.

[MercureXI]

Being a glorified battery is great and all well and good until you stick 4 glorified batterys into one group expect it to somehow perform anywhere close to as well as so called "pure dps".

That's where job synergy enters the ring.

The real pb is this :

"BUT I WANT TO RUN AROUND ENDLESSLY SPAMMING SKILLS WITH NO CAST TIME AND DO DAMAGE LIKE A DRAGOON BUT WITH NO DRAWBACKS AND ZERO RISK WHY DO I NEED TO THINK ABOUT MY ROTATION NOW?????"
- every bad bard since HW launch-

If you have 15 seconds of no mechanics, you can drop into WM for that bonus damage then drop it the instant you need to move.

[MercureXI]

Essentially, most bards are complaining because the game is giving you an incentive to stand still rather than run around pointlessly. You can now turn WM off easily whenever you have to move to dodge or handle mechanics and continue dps'ing in the 2.0 style; which is still more than other classes can do. How does this affect the way you play Bard unless you played it redundantly to begin with; running around aimlessly for no reason ?