My Opinion about the Dark knights need redesigning threads.

[Lionheart401]

I honestly think dark knight is great the way it is. As of right now, I haven't had any problems running dungeons or trials as a dark knight which means there is nothing wrong. I think people are judging too soon. At least wait until the raids come out and then see if darks need reworking. I love dark dance the way it is. As a warrior I know featherfoot is very handy and dark dance is my featherfoot for a dark knight. One of the best ways to mitigate damage, is to avoid it. you really appreciate it with big pulls. On top of the evasion buff you get a buff in parry. this skill is crazy good.

Everything i liked about warrior, I can do as a dark knight so I'm not complaining. Dark knights have skills to mitigate physical and magical attacks, that's pretty damn good for tanking.

[Lionheart401]

I say everyone should stop crying. Keep getting better with playing dark knights (since dark knight is still a very young job). I like warrior now but i liked it back then and didn't feel it needed to be changed but I never got to take on turn 5 with Pre 2.1 warrior so I can understand why they were complaining about the warrior class at the time. The content now is too baby to say dark knights need revamping.

I think all these dark threads is just wishful thinking. They want abilities to do more but don't need it. There's a difference between wanting and needing.

[Arkard]

You can't really say that people's complaints are invalid because the content and the class itself is young, and then in the same sentence insist that the class is fine.

You don't know that. You can't know that. You're right that we won't know for sure what changes need to be made to the class right now without tanking raid content. That said, for the same reason you explain, we can't know that the class in its current condition is fine.

You can't invalidate everyone else's points with an argument that also invalidates your own.

[TheCount]

snip

I don't see any Dark Knight on your profile, so I can't see what level you actually are if you play it. However it's just objectively true that Dark Knights need some adjusting, they don't have good enough ways to regen mana against single targets. They can't keep up their damage debuff. They have defensive cooldowns that do the same thing/are slightly worse compared to the other tanks their version but still have a longer cooldown despite that. Some of their abilities require a shit ton of mana to the point it's questionable to use it at all because of their mana issues (this would be fixed if they could actually use blood weapon in grit but for some reason they cannot) The int debuff that they CAN actually keep up is completely useless if you have a monk because their version is just plain better

And then there is the people saying they are squishy compared to other tanks in extreme modes, though I have yet to see that one for myself. I'm inclined to believe them however with a lack of a shield. Do you actually play Dark Knight? Because any who do can see these things. I might be doing okay in dungeons so far but with these issues I do wonder what use Dark Knights will have in raids or how well they will perform.

[Lionheart401]

I don't see any Dark Knight on your profile, so I can't see what level you actually are if you play it. However it's just objectively true that Dark Knights need some adjusting, they don't have good enough ways to regen mana against single targets. They can't keep up their damage debuff. They have defensive cooldowns that do the same thing/are slightly worse compared to the other tanks their version but still have a longer cooldown despite that.

I have a dark knight at level 59 currently.
Blood Price is all I need when I'm tanking. It has a crazy short recast timer.
Blood weapon is all I need when attacking. Short recast timer.
Do you really need more?
They can keep up an int debuff so they are weakening int-based damages all the time and they also get the damage debuff on top of that. Dark Dance helps you keep the Damage Debuff going although its not constantly up, you do have two debuffs going.

[Lionheart401]

And then there is the people saying they are squishy compared to other tanks in extreme modes, though I have yet to see that one for myself. I'm inclined to believe them however with a lack of a shield. Do you actually play Dark Knight? Because any who do can see these things. I might be doing okay in dungeons so far but with these issues I do wonder what use Dark Knights will have in raids or how well they will perform.

Doesn't matter how much mp those moves cost. Your mp regenerates. If you actually
know how to balance your moves you wouldn't have trouble with the mp like I do.
Bloodweapon and Bloodprice is overpowered. I do great without both. I only felt like I needed both when I first started playing the class cause I didn't know how to use the job and wanted both abilities as a security blanket. But I understand the class now.

squishy without a shield? have you seen warriors? do you play dark knight? I've tanked extreme mode fights.

[Asierid]

squishy without a shield? have you seen warriors? do you play dark knight? I've tanked extreme mode fights.

Any of the two tanks can do the job of a DRK better than a DRK could. That's the problem. You can do damage/threat while tanking, great. Now the unchained WAR will pull it from you in one rotation. You can mitigate, great. Why is that PLD sleeping through the tank busters while you nearly shit yourself attempting to get it mitigated?

Off tank DPS? Fell Cleave is leaving you behind.

I mean, if you like to work hard for sub-standard results, that's great. No one else here does.

[Alphras]

Off tank DPS? Fell Cleave is leaving you behind.

Can you please link me to these insane WAR dps parses (or vids) that everyone seems to be talking about? I have seen DRK at 900+, but nothing for WAR yet.

[Ditto]

Can you please link me to these insane WAR dps parses (or vids) that everyone seems to be talking about? I have seen DRK at 900+, but nothing for WAR yet.

A good War will pull more than a Drk, not by a lot, but it's definitely not an insane amount.

That is, for the duration of a Drk's TP. A War will never run out of TP, or at least not very fast, if at all. A Drk will burn their TP less than halfway into the fight if they have 0 downtime between skills, and they have absolutely no way to recover their TP.

TP is the main problem. Outside of TP issues, War pulls ahead by a bit still, but nothing 'insane'.

dark arts with the enmity combo drowns out everyone else's hate.
if those other tanks are playing properly, they would have their tank stance off and not be as big of a threat as the dark is.
dark arts is so clutch and its always ready for you.
if other tanks are giving you hate problem dark arts and enmity combo.
paladin mitigate. warriors compensate and drks mit/comp/evade.
have you tried dark arts passenger followed with dark arts dark dance? evasion is nice.

Well congrats, you just ran out of MP and lost Darkside faster than you can say MP.

WAR does not out DPS either tank in OT situations, my FC has a plethora of tanks so we run a few as DPS for Bis/Rav Ex. especially since we can keep up with regular DPS and take a hit. Fel Cleave is great, but really only makes up for WARs lack of potency in general.

Tanking wise, in current content, all three tanks seem to be about equal. Rav Ex's Blinding Blade hits hard no matter what CD you use if you are tanking it solo. Granted I don't know why you wouldn't just throw a few of your higher HP DPS in to eat it with the tank when solo tanking seems foolish to let, even a PLD, eat 90% of his HP when it could easily be split 3 ways. Or just bring the second tank since OT DPS is damn near on par with regular DPS.

Monk is the least played DPS class, still (my FC has zero MNK mains), and DRK can reduce INT by 10%, none of the other tanks can do this, every fight so far has magic damage so it's a nice perk. Also Reprisal and Storm's Path stack, so if your DRK is MTing you're getting 20% damage reduction when Reprisal is up. If you want to view it over the whole fight, taking into consideration up-time, it's 16.7% raid wide damage reduction.

I'm working on getting WAR leveled to have both DRK/WAR for content, and I like both classes, but really the differences between them are smaller than the forums make them to be.

The only magic damage in Ravana EX (As fara s I know) are the hadoukens, and the split damage AOE after pillars of heaven. None of which do any bit threatening damage.

All the damage that matters is physical. Also, Dragons Kick > Delirium. Half the time I cant even put Delirioum on Ravan for some reason, and we don't have a Monk.

Also, Wars out DPS Drk's in OT situations ESPECIALLY, simply due to TP. Equilibrium keeps a Wars TP afloat. Drk burns their TP in literally 3 Blood Weapons if they have constant uptime.