The completely REASONABLE changes to the Dark Knight job thread

[Xenosan]

I was playing my WAR just to see how Au Ra used an axe and I noticed my parries were about 5% less damage reduction than pre-HW.

From all accounts, personal observation, and patch notes:

STR no longer increases Parry damage reduction amounts. This is the same at any level. It's not a Heavensward exclusive change.

Were the enmity multipliers of Drk ever posted?

This is something that hasn't been discussed, but should. Particulary the enmity modifiers for Power Slash.

The tool tip suggest that it's modifier comes from Dark Arts, the combo bonus is just the WS potency increase.

Does Power Slash combo'd have a enmity modifier, and what does combo'd Power Slash aggro amount to versus a non-combo'd, Dark Arts buffed 100 potency Power Slash.

From my own experience I've used it to grab adds in some situations.. Garuda Ex, Dreadnaught in the MSQ final dungeon, etc. Pro-DPS friendlies can make it not so reliable snap aggro.. Sounds like more QoL for DRK, our a$$ is covered if we forget to prime our enmity combo before Add spawns.

[Ipkonfig]

It's not short sighted, and I'm in no way complaining, the thread is about changes, and while I personally enjoy DRK and have zero issues. I WANT those things because I think they would be a nice QoL. DPS are in a group to deal damage and no matter how many you have they can always do that job. In content that requires two tanks, but not at the same time, there is down time where a tank is not filling his roll, he's basically just a weaker DPS, insert tank utility making them more relevant. There are things a PLD and WAR can do that no other class can, but for DRK there is nothing. DRK lucks out since MNK is still the least played class in the game making the INT debuff they bring useful. I see nothing wrong with adding some unique flavor to our dark friend.

I don't think anything NEEDS to be done with DRK though. I tank fine, I hold aggro, my healers don't complain I'm taking to much damage, and spend there time DPSing to help speed up the grind. Regardless I'll have DRK and WAR 60 soon enough and play both depending on what the content needs.

[Nanaho]

this is the reason why WAR didn't get a parry bonus to their tanking stance. .

Actually, Need to correct you here, WARs Wrath stacks now offer Parry instead of Crit since the expansion, so yes indeed, they did get a parry bonus with their tanking stance.

[Hundred]

This is something that hasn't been discussed, but should. Particulary the enmity modifiers for Power Slash.

I'm very interested because the enmity state is going to make some things clearer.
It says Dark arts combo potency which to me meant the boost is only when in a combo, however its still odd to ascertain how potent this is?
I've done attempts where its say DA combo'd Power slash, then I'm trying to see how many SE rotations I can get in before aggro drops. I don't feel to impressed by it atm.

I see nothing wrong with adding some unique flavor to our dark friend.

Dark Mind is their own specific Niche. The Bonus evasion on Dark dance is a twist in comparison to Bullwarks straight 60% Parry. Drks mean you can provide a Monks -int debuff without a monk which only makes it easier to vary team composition. The whole 'flavor' route is done, the real questions are Drks actual performance and if that performance is under,over or the same as other tanks. If its not the same why does it differ is the difference the same in all situations.

[Ipkonfig]

That's not what I'm referring too. All three tanks have their own ways of mitigating damage. PLD is more physical, WAR has Inner Beast for small windows of burst mitigation, DRK has more magic mitigation.

Assuming a fight forces tank swaps, utility is what makes the OT relevant since they are essentially, at that point, a weaker DPS. So Paladin has STR down, Clemancy, Divine Veil, and Cover. Warrior has Storm's Path and Storm's Eye (Ninja brings this, but they gain DPS if they drop it from rotation and let WAR do it). DRK just has INT down which a MNK can also bring, and that's it. There is now plenty of evidence to show the three tanks all do roughly the same OT DPS, so it would be nice to add a little something, but utility isn't required to complete content, it's just nice to have.

[Xenosan]

Dark Mind is their own specific Niche. The Bonus evasion on Dark dance is a twist in comparison to Bullwarks straight 60% Parry. Drks mean you can provide a Monks -int debuff without a monk which only makes it easier to vary team composition. The whole 'flavor' route is done, the real questions are Drks actual performance and if that performance is under,over or the same as other tanks. If its not the same why does it differ is the difference the same in all situations.

Dark Dance =/= Bulwark. The dice roll on Parry happens after the dice roll on Shield block. Shields block for ~30% of each hit opposed to Parry's 20%. Bulwark raises Shield Block to ~80% depending on the shield. If the dice roll on Shield Block fails, PLD still has the second dice roll on Parry.

Regarding tank busters, for PLD - if Sentinel, Rampart, & Hallowed Ground are exhausted - any combination of ( Convalescence, Foresight, Bulwark, Stoneskin, Awareness, Bloodbath ) can be used for things like Death Sentence and Mountain Buster. Stoneskin has no recast limitation save for cast interruption & MP. For PLD, all these secondary mitigation CDs sit behind a passive chance to Shield Block and Parry, giving the CDs increased Umph.

None of these secondaries are traited for DRK, DRK have longer recast or lower effectiveness with all of them, and no SS at all.

Factor the meta of combat in FFXIV, any increase to Parry short of guaranteed (Raw Intuition), or not 100% up-keep is of lowest value in a mitigation repertoire. Parry is the ugly duckling of mitigation features - a bleedover of 1.0 mechanics.

WAR's Raw Intuition, PLD's double-dip RNG per physical attack, and DRK's Low Blow reset & Reprisal proc are what makes Parry valuable for each job.

Like Souleater's self-heal, Parry is not something your healers anticipate or pace their healing behavior around. They will not 'feel' the presence of your Dark Dance buff. Parry is not structural pillar of Tank EHP. Never was. With the removal of STR stat influence over it's mitigation amount, it's even less of a EHP boost than it was before.

Thus far there hasn't been a single instance where I felt that I was to squishy...

A good thing and I would agree the same, but let's not move the goal post. The question isn't whether DRK is capable, it's where DRK sits viably in a party composition for post-50/post-60 content progression. Unless the boss auto attacks strictly with Magical Damage, I don't think DRK holds ground to a Paladin MT. With the lack of utility DRK brings as OT, they don't hold water to Warrior in that role.

More utility and a on-demand EHP buffer for physicals would help make DRK more viable for either role.

Change the Dark Arts buff for Dark Dance so it's +EVA for everyone in a 7y radius.

Change the Dark Arts buff for Dark Mind so it's +15% Magical Resistance for everyone in a 7y radius.

This would help so much with progression if it prevents a squishy Caster or Healer from getting OHKO'd by a plum or other AOE mechanic. It would even improve DRK/DRK compositions because the OT DRK could rotate DM with the MT, improving it from 16% up-keep to 33%.

For MT role, improve the Soul Devourer trait (lvl48) so that Dark Arts buff'd Souleater erects a magical barrier worth 10% of base HP/VIT (an on-demand cross-classed Stoneskin, but slightly not as good). As an added bonus allow the Barrier to be fed additional HPs via Souleater's if the absorbed HPs are over-healing him (maxed barrier at 15-20%). A potentially sustaining Stoneskin/Thrill of Battle hybrid -- that as a catch-22 -- requires more resources and effort to maintain.

Granted these are just some ideas of numerous amount rolling across the Forum,

Being over-geared is inapplicable. Progressions and World Firsts / FC Firsts Clears are about content in which over-gearing isn't possible. It may be fine now but what happens when Alexander Savage releases? DRK will likely take the back-seat to PLD/WAR.

[Hundred]

snip

On the contrary dark dance does. What you're discussing is the specific part of Pld's shield. Dark dance is straight out comparable to Bulwark itself *and* has a third of its cooldown. This is splitting hairs as PLD gets extra mileage in general from having a shield.

Dont confuse this for a claim for Parrys potency nor Evasions, it isn't. It's the reality of Dark dance relative to Bullwark where you have 30% + 20% on a third of the cooldown.

[Ipkonfig]

Paladin's don't "double dip" block directly reduces the effectiveness of parry. Using your 30% block and 20% parry the paladin would actually have 14% parry. With Bulwark up that same paladin would have 90% block and 2% parry. You can't parry an attack you blocked, it is still solid mitigation, but not double dipping.

Hundred is also correct. Taking into account up-time and equal levels of block rate/strength and parry rate/strength for both paladin and dark knight, keeping both Bulwark and Dark Art + Dark Dance on CD the mitigation is identical. Meaning that Dark Arts + Dark Dance makes up for the lack of shield, or at least that's what it seems to be designed for. There will be discrepancies because some attacks can't be evaded. But block/parry/evade are more useful for auto attack mitigation than controlled burst.

Convalescence, Foresight, Bulwark, Stoneskin, Awareness, and Bloodbath. These cool-downs you listed the only one that is a little useful for defending against a tank buster is Foresight, and even then it's only a ~5% physical reduction. Convalescence just helps healers catch up but doesn't mitigate anything. Bulwark, even if it's 90% block there is a chance you take the full hit. Stoneskin can be cast by any healer, and with Clemency (can't be interrupted) now it seems like a giant waste of MP to cast something that any healer can do, also you can't block or parry while casting which is fun. Awareness only applies to crits and the only boss thus far that could crit was Shiva and it wasn't a tank buster. Bloodbath is just like Convalescence, just helps repair the damage not stop it.

Tank busters have always been more about the heal/debuff coordination than the tank. Cool downs are great and helpful, but unless you are popping Hallowed Ground, it will hit the tank hard no matter the cool down and the healers have to react. T5/T9/T13 if it's just the tank using Rampart or Inner Beast the buster is going to hit hard and be more difficult to deal with, but coordinate an Adlo, WHM Stoneskin, and Virus it becomes far more manageable.

[Praesul]

This is something that hasn't been discussed, but should. Particulary the enmity modifiers for Power Slash.

The tool tip suggest that it's modifier comes from Dark Arts, the combo bonus is just the WS potency increase.

Does Power Slash combo'd have a enmity modifier, and what does combo'd Power Slash aggro amount to versus a non-combo'd, Dark Arts buffed 100 potency Power Slash.

From my own experience I've used it to grab adds in some situations.. Garuda Ex, Dreadnaught in the MSQ final dungeon, etc. Pro-DPS friendlies can make it not so reliable snap aggro.. Sounds like more QoL for DRK, our a$$ is covered if we forget to prime our enmity combo before Add spawns.

The tooltip says it has increased enmity, regardless of combo or dark arts. The tooltip then says that it gets increased enmity when used with dark arts.

So yes, it has a modifier even without dark arts. Unless I'm misunderstanding you?

[Tsukotaku]

Fully agree with the first post, you basically had my same thoughts. Also, right now this class doesn't offer anything unique to be considered an "alternative" to the PLD for raiding. Which is something that has to be changed ASAP before Alexander comes. Without to mention that 320 seconds of CD for Living Dead is too much for what this ability has to offer, compared to Holmgang and Hallowed Ground.