Your thoughts on Astrolgian so far?

[Leiloni]

In regards to the healing output complaints, Ghislain did some math that nicely illustrates how base healing of all three healers are actually the same. It's in the emergency healing, saving the day department that AST's suffer but outside of that they're actually fine - just different. Here's his quote:

Cure - 400 Potency / GCD
Physik - 400 Potency / GCD
Diurnal Sect Benefic - 380 Potency @ 2.38 cast = 380 * (2.5/2.38) = 399 Potency / GCD
Nocturnal Sect Benefic - 380 Potency + 5% = 380 *1.05 = 399 Potency / GCD

Cure II - 650 Potency / GCD
Adlo - 600 Potency / GCD when correcting for shields (non crit)
Diurnal Sect Benefic II - 620 Potency @ 2.38 cast = 620 * (2.5/2.38) = 651 Potency / GCD
Nocturnal Sect Benefic - 620 Potency + 5% = 380 *1.05 = 651 Potency / GCD

Medica - 300 Potency / GCD
Succor - 300 Potency / GCD when correcting for shields
Diurnal Sect Helios - 290 Potency @ 2.38 cast = 290 * (2.5/2.38) = 304 Potency / GCD
Nocturnal Sect Benefic - 290 Potency + 5% = 380 *1.05 = 304 Potency / GCD

I dunno about you, but the baseline healing output looks quite similar to me. As I mentioned, AST lacks the means to easily boost those numbers in their favour, but it doesn't mean their actual bread and butter heals are weaker.

As for MP management, that also should not be an issue. You all seem to forget that pre 3.0, all WHM had was Shroud of Saints, which is exactly the same as Luminiferous Aether except AST's skill has a shorter CD. Outside of that, yes WHM gets the occasional free heal, but AST has cheaper cost on their heals, so it all balances out. WHM's learned how to manage their mana and never had any major problems, and so can you. Just because SCH had it easy in the MP department, that doesn't mean the WHM was hard and neither should the AST be. Any AST who previously played a WHM likely has already figured out how to manage mana and should be fine.

[sharazisspecial]

Any AST who previously played a WHM likely has already figured out how to manage mana and should be fine

NOCT AST is extremly mana inefficient

DI AST is better but

Don't forget how much divine seal adds to helping reduce mana costs, you require lower level heals or less heals whereas a AST may have to cast a higher level heal or 2 heals instead. Raids stacking for Cure 3 make WHM alot more mana efficient too. Cure spam for free cost cure 2 is a well designed proc.

[Zoralink]

In regards to the healing output complaints, Ghislain did some math that nicely illustrates how base healing of all three healers are actually the same. It's in the emergency healing, saving the day department that AST's suffer but outside of that they're actually fine - just different. Here's his quote:



As for MP management, that also should not be an issue. You all seem to forget that pre 3.0, all WHM had was Shroud of Saints, which is exactly the same as Luminiferous Aether except AST's skill has a shorter CD. Outside of that, yes WHM gets the occasional free heal, but AST has cheaper cost on their heals, so it all balances out. WHM's learned how to manage their mana and never had any major problems, and so can you. Just because SCH had it easy in the MP department, that doesn't mean the WHM was hard and neither should the AST be. Any AST who previously played a WHM likely has already figured out how to manage mana and should be fine.

After spending more time considering it, there's three main things that I think need to happen:

-Lightspeed should also grant a 50% haste buff on top of its current effects. This would make AST into a machine gun healer, but they would consume mana heavily during it. Slightly lower the cooldown to 2 minutes instead of 2 and a half.

-Collective Unconscious should regenerate 5% mana every 3 seconds while channeling. This would encourage channeling it and reward you while retaining its flavor.

-I stand by making Synnastry a perma-buff in Noct sect. Noct is currently meant to be the 'scholar' of the group, but has no capacity for multi target healing outside of helios. That is the big defining feature of scholar. Making Synnastry permanent at something like 30% potency would give noct a 'fairy' while retaining the flavor still. In Diurnal, retain its current effects but reduce its cooldown to a minute and a half or so, as diurnal can use it much more effectively as a larger cooldown.

These three together would fix some of the larger issues, giving AST a big "Oh shit" button in the form of light speed without just being a flat, boring healing increase, gives them an MP regeneration tool other than luminiferous aether to help offset the aforementioned while also making Collective Unconscious less crap, and buffs noct such that their biggest issue which is their inability to multi heal is resolved.

*Shrug*

EDIT: Oh and let us use spread out of combat.

EDIT2: In an ideal world, I'd like to be able to swap between diurnal and nocturnal mid combat, but I doubt SE would permit that to happen. Doing this *without* doing the above (except perhaps the Collective Unconscious buff) would actually give AST a choice of tossing out their regens, then swapping to Noct to utilize their shields. Give it a cooldown of something like 45 seconds to a minute if they're worried about it being abused.

I doubt they'll ever allow that to happen though. I wish they would, would give AST an absurdly high skill ceiling.

[RichardButte]

After spending more time considering it, there's three main things that I think need to happen:

I can agree with these, and I think I'd also like to see the cooldowns on all card-related abilities reduced.

20 sec for draw (and FFS, start the cooldown on it when the card is drawn, NOT when we use it or right click it to remove it manually if we want to get rid of it), 30 sec for Spread, 60 for shuffle, and make shuffle NOT redraw the same card.

[SaintK]

3 times a minute* with the possibility of dismissing the fairy for 3 more once every 3 minutes.
I have to admit, AST is functional, and the card buffs are strong, but the healing really is quite middle-of-the road. Their AOE healing is quite good though. Still beats SCH since they don't have to wait on CDs to do so with real potency....

People are overlooking what the main complaint is. Compared to the other heals AST is mediocre at best. You say scholar aoe healing is worse than AST. That simply is not true, it might have been true if AST was released pre heavensward. Succor is has a wider AOE iirc, and yes, your new aoe is 15 yalms but at least its instant and about the same as helios, AND you have a pet throwing a 300 auto pilot cure on the lowest party member, who can also whispering dawn AOE healing. How is AST aoe healing better than sch again? WHM with divine seal medica 2 is practically three times more potent than one helios.

[Mhikail]

Please fix Shuffle.
If I draw the fcking Spire card one more time...
I drew it 6 TIMES in a row...
This almost made me wanna quit playing AST now. :/

[Shamirah]

Also, if you look at the job presentation back from the live letter... you can see the AST use time dilatation on herself.

If lightspeed reduces potency, it should also reduce mana cost. Even if you buff lightspeed, you'll be oom in two sec. And channeling Collective Unconscious to regen mana sounds great but it is way unreliable.

Mana issues are really something you get if you use lightspeed. Which is dumb. Our throughput cd should not oom us.

(I never use lightspeed... it's really that useless. Oh no i do use it to dispell quickly. That's about it.)

[SaintK]

In regards to the healing output complaints, Ghislain did some math that nicely illustrates how base healing of all three healers are actually the same. It's in the emergency healing, saving the day department that AST's suffer but outside of that they're actually fine - just different. Here's his quote:



......

Its not the same. Take into account that WHM has big cooldowns and SCH has a pet healing for almost as much as benefic 1 every few seconds. SCH can also buff their potencies by a ridiculous amount, and literally make nocturnal sect completely useless.

[Nague]

In regards to the healing output complaints, Ghislain did some math that nicely illustrates how base healing of all three healers are actually the same. It's in the emergency healing, saving the day department that AST's suffer but outside of that they're actually fine - just different. Here's his quote:


.

Oh so outside of actually healing difficult content, AST is a good healer, thats great.

[fanservice]

People are overlooking what the main complaint is. Compared to the other heals AST is mediocre at best. You say scholar aoe healing is worse than AST. That simply is not true, it might have been true if AST was released pre heavensward. Succor is has a wider AOE iirc, and yes, your new aoe is 15 yalms but at least its instant and about the same as helios, AND you have a pet throwing a 300 auto pilot cure on the lowest party member, who can also whispering dawn AOE healing. How is AST aoe healing better than sch again? WHM with divine seal medica 2 is practically three times more potent than one helios.

As much as I hate comparing things in a vacuum, I think I'm dangerously close to doing just that, but here goes:

Succor in itself is a poor AOE heal for actual damage recovery. It should be precasted once before major group damage, and once after. Any more than that, and you're literally wasting half of its MP cost.

Square now gave SCHs indomitability (400 potency instant cast AOE heal), and emergency tactics (converts shield effect of next spell to bonus healing, which is like turning your next succor into medica). Each of these abilities have a 30 second cooldown. Whispering dawn has a 1min cooldown, and also potent.

'Beats' may have been the wrong word, but what I meant was AST doesn't need to rely on a cooldown to AOE heal with the potency of a WHM.