Dragoon Punished at lvl 58 - What needs to be done with Wheeling Thrust

[Galand]

What about our 60 ability, that seems pretty weak imo, either reduce the time reduction to 5 seconds or make it stronger then 200 potency

[Joon143]

Gotta say the whole concept of Fang and Claw and Wheeling Thrust is ridiculous. The only difference is that you either have to attack from the rear or the flank depending on Mr. Random.

[Vinestra]

OP is right: obtaining Wheeling Thrust at 58 breaks the expectation that you're getting stronger/learning new techniques/attuning with your job crystal soul. When you, the player, realize that the game just made your skill usage more complex but not more powerful, you feel slighted by the game and whoever designed the skill/quest..

So if Dragoons got slighted / ohh the humanity over 1 skill not being golden/good. What about machinist ;n;
Machinist currently gets 5/7 abilities that are useless starting from 50 they are: Dismantle, Gauss Barrel (doesn't increase damage (decreases damage)) Gauss round (locked behind gauss barrel), Rend Mind, and Ricochet (also locked behind gauss barrel). Also level 30 to 50 there's plenty of other useless skills. As well as more rng.
But yeah.. sympathy hugs!

[Trespar]

I thought these abilities would be just be a proper 4th chain to both combos. The idea that it's randomized in some way feels really annoying.

And what's worse is that apparently their potency is lower than Full Thrust, and only slightly higher than Chaos Thrust minus the DoT? How is that even a satisfying conclusion to a combo?

[Drakolos]

I thought these abilities would be just be a proper 4th chain to both combos. The idea that it's randomized in some way feels really annoying.

And what's worse is that apparently their potency is lower than Full Thrust, and only slightly higher than Chaos Thrust minus the DoT? How is that even a satisfying conclusion to a combo?

Because it's an additional 290 potency. For the 360 petency you have to use 2 weaker skills until you can use it again. It also extend BotD which is also a great DPS boost due to the faster auto attacks.

[Dervy]

I thought these abilities would be just be a proper 4th chain to both combos. The idea that it's randomized in some way feels really annoying.

And what's worse is that apparently their potency is lower than Full Thrust, and only slightly higher than Chaos Thrust minus the DoT? How is that even a satisfying conclusion to a combo?

Well, as long as the potency for those additional skills are above 260, it's a PPS increase.

[Leoheart]

What about our 60 ability, that seems pretty weak imo, either reduce the time reduction to 5 seconds or make it stronger then 200 potency

It reduces our Dragon Blood by 10 seconds on each use and as an Off GCD That functions like doomspike, I'm actually very impressed with it so far.

[Underdog2204]

So if Dragoons got slighted / ohh the humanity over 1 skill not being golden/good. What about machinist ;n;
Machinist currently gets 5/7 abilities that are useless starting from 50 they are: Dismantle, Gauss Barrel (doesn't increase damage (decreases damage)) Gauss round (locked behind gauss barrel), Rend Mind, and Ricochet (also locked behind gauss barrel). Also level 30 to 50 there's plenty of other useless skills. As well as more rng.
But yeah.. sympathy hugs!

Ikr, it must be so tough being able to pull over 1k dps.

Not like MCH and BRD's have been given nothing even remotely useful in the skillsets, but damn the one Dragoon skill much be such a chore to use and requires nearly 100 responses signaling how much priority this injustice must be given...

Being able to pull 1k+ dps have have party wide boosts must be such a pain...

Yeah I've never liked a lot Dragoon players for their whole "woe is me" mentality that has been around since release -_-

[Evander_Lefoux]

I thought I would take a moment to offer my experience with both abilities and my thoughts on them and other things.

At first, I was completely terrified of getting them, and thought a RNG Factor would completely destroy the class for me. I even considered dropping my Dragoon entirely for a different Job. This was due to reading so many negative things about "Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw", about how they proc randomly and can completely screw up your rotation. Never knowing if you need to be behind or at the side.

But then I got to Level 56 and got the first of the two dreaded skills. "Fang and Claw". Having it proc after every combo, I was able to easily be in position to perform it for full potency. I quickly grew used to it, always moving to the side after a combo finished to be ready before the Global Cool-down refreshed.

Two levels later, I obtained "Wheeling Thrust", and dreaded the RNG Factor that would undoubtedly show its face. I went into a dungeon tentatively, worried that my entire rotation would be just a massive mess of frustration. I finished my first combo, "Fang and Claw" popped. I got into position before the Global Cool-down finished. I finished my next combo, "Wheeling Thrust" popped. I got into position before the Global Cool-down finished.

At first, I thought perhaps what I had read was wrong and that they simply alternated between the two. But then I got two "Wheeling Thrust"s in a row. Then three in a row. It threw me off for a bit, but the length of the Global Cool-down and the duration of the combo effect that enables "Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw" allowed me ample time to compensate and re-position without dropping my damage output.

I will readily admit that I have missed a few positionals due to enemies moving, but I see even the lower potency as an increase in damage output over what I had at Level 50 through 54. Even at 56 with just "Fang and Claw", you are not guaranteed the increased potency. The enemy could turn at the wrong time, or the Tank could be re-positioning it. Level 58 adds another layer of complexity, admittedly, but it is still another guaranteed increase in damage regardless of whether you are in the correct position.

"Blood of the Dragon" boosts your damage output by enabling the usage of "Wheeling Thrust", "Fang and Claw", and "Geirskogul", and can be indefinitely maintained via "Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw" whether or not you are in the correct position for those two abilities. As such, while it may seem like a decrease in damage output due to missing the positional, it is still an increase due to maintaining "Blood of the Dragon". So long as you keep that ability up, you can still use the three new abilities. You can still increase your damage output beyond what you had at 50-54.

In this way, "Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw" are increases to damage output regardless of their own potency. Hitting the correct positional is quite nice, yes, but missing it is not detrimental to the overall rotation. So long as you can maintain "Blood of the Dragon", everything will be fine. The randomized nature of "Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw" does add a layer of complexity to the class, but the Global Cool-down and combo effect allow ample time to re-position for maximum potency, unless you have incorrectly managed your "Blood of the Dragon" or utilized "Geirskogul" too rapidly in succession.

I am now sitting at Level 60, and am fully comfortable with the new abilities. My rotation works as smoothly as it did when it was Level 50. I realize not everyone will attain comfort with the new abilities and integrating them into their rotation due to the randomized nature of two of them, but I personally do not have any issues due to the explanations above.

Too Long; Did Not Read Version:

Global Cool-down and Combo Effect Timer offer enough time to re-position for full potency.

Increase in damage output regardless of full potency.

Both abilities maintain "Blood of the Dragon" buff with or without positional correctness.

To those saying Dragoon does not have positionals, keep in mind "Chaos Thrust" has increased potency from behind and "Heavy Thrust" has increased potency from the flank/side. Additionally, "Ring of Thorns" will only proc if "Heavy Thrust" is landed from the flank/side.

"Wheeling Thrust" and "Fang and Claw" add a layer of complexity that I personally find enjoyable.

<silly> My Lance fires dragons. Bows fire arrows. Your move, Bards. </silly>

[Joon143]

Ikr, it must be so tough being able to pull over 1k dps.

Not like MCH and BRD's have been given nothing even remotely useful in the skillsets, but damn the one Dragoon skill much be such a chore to use and requires nearly 100 responses signaling how much priority this injustice must be given...

Being able to pull 1k+ dps have have party wide boosts must be such a pain...

Yeah I've never liked a lot Dragoon players for their whole "woe is me" mentality that has been around since release -_-

I can only see pessimism from these posts. Isn´t MCH and BRDs role as a dps a bit different considering some of the skills they have

Anyways for my part I don´t care about the dps, it´s just the fact that we now have to rely on a random factor which makes the job less fun for me at least.