Raid runs and gear drops

[Cursive]

You haven't been reading the posts carefully. I didn't say a melee setup can't be done, I said people rather hit the easy button then try to include various classes. SE making stronger incentives for diverse parties is the best way to go. Is it inevitable that people find ways around anything? Yes. Not doing anything about it though is eventually going to go back to the way FFXI was.

I feel like this debate is going in various directions. x_x

People made a good point that if you can't perform a speed run with your setup, it is your fault. There is no argument against that. If you don't want to take a challenge, then level mage or archer and just burn it down. I just simply don't want end game LS's believing it is "this way or the highway". It happened in FFXI, and don't want it to repeat itself in FFXIV. You can say other MMO's do this, but for most of them, all classes are welcomed at least and based more on gear/skill. Back then, in high end LS's, it was hard to get your Puppetmaster into an HNM fight, since most of them didn't want them in there, no matter how well geared you were.

But who knows what will happen in 1.19 and 1.20. It could make everything I said completely invalid

Everyone here has actually brought in pretty good points against the matter, so it mostly boils down to throwing the same statement at each other over and over.

the comment arc and mage only is easy mode is ridiculous. have you even completed a speed run? let alone a five chest speed run? watching videos and calling it easy mode is ignorant. of course the video makes it look easy...it is based on however many hours of trial and error.


end game shells usually require certain set-ups because they are goal oriented....they do things for a very specific purpose and in the most efficient way...path of least resistance. that will never change, no matter what se does. so please stop crying about it and do either of the things people have suggested...figure out how to make melee more useful or rank arc or a mage.

[Velhart]

the comment arc and mage only is easy mode is ridiculous. have you even completed a speed run? let alone a five chest speed run? watching videos and calling it easy mode is ignorant. of course the video makes it look easy...it is based on however many hours of trial and error.


end game shells usually require certain set-ups because they are goal oriented....they do things for a very specific purpose and in the most efficient way...path of least resistance. that will never change, no matter what se does. so please stop crying about it and do either of the things people have suggested...figure out how to make melee more useful or rank arc or a mage.

You can put "Easy" mode in a game, but it doesn't mean it is easy for you in particular. Maybe I should give you a better word to work with, "Easier", or maybe "More convenient".

[Cursive]

You can put "Easy" mode in a game, but it doesn't mean it is easy for you in particular. Maybe I should give you a better word to work with, "Easier", or maybe "More convenient".

easy does not mean convenient (not to mention the fact that the dungeon is retardedly easy). please go try a five chest speed run with mar, 4 arc, 2 con, 1 thm or any combination of arc and mages.

[Velhart]

easy does not mean convenient (not to mention the fact that the dungeon is retardedly easy). please go try a five chest speed run with mar, 4 arc, 2 con, 1 thm or any combination of arc and mages.

Actually yea, it kind of does mean that. Haha

Been through it many times, I am 100% aware how difficult a speed run is, and still stand by what I said.

[EcchiMan]

You can put "Easy" mode in a game, but it doesn't mean it is easy for you in particular. Maybe I should give you a better word to work with, "Easier", or maybe "More convenient".

I like the Phrase, "Less Cumbersome."

[Haji]

end game shells usually require certain set-ups because they are goal oriented....they do things for a very specific purpose and in the most efficient way...path of least resistance. that will never change, no matter what se does.

This is just the newest example of people that try to rationalize what is going on by saying that players will always shunt some classes aside and promote others. Well, I just spent some time making sure about certain observation of mine, and what (little unfortunately) I fund is that in WoW for all instances and purposes there are no classes considered "usless" or "inconvinient". Certain builds are ignored, yes, but classes? No. That means that yes, you can make a game where every class can contribute more or less equally.

And before the standarad "WoW is played by nabs" argument comes out, I was specifically looking for how the most hardcore (usually getting "first on the sever kill" achivments) guilds are doing things.