Please disable changing Cleric Stance during combat for make healer focus on healing.

[Hiragawa]

If they can remove cleric stance just add a trait for each Healer. Which makes their damage spells scale of their mind stat.

This is exactly what they shouldn't do. The entire point of the Cleric Stance buff is so that it's a trade off. The cooldown is there to prevent you from just flicking it on and off all the time without second thought. It requires foresight to use in hectic situations, and is also NOT required on ANY CONTENT unless you are one of the server first folks pushing raids/etc in the base gear level for a zone and such.

By simply allowing healers to automatically use their damage spells will take away the trade off and make them all around too powerful. You'll be coming across healers that are neigh unkillable in a lot of content, even moreso than they already are. (As you see in these other MMOs) Cleric stance works perfectly fine as it is, just don't use it if you don't want to use it. The "expected dps" from healers in server first content is really just with them, and I promise you none of them would ever be in this thread complaining about it, because they manage the mechanic just fine.

And as to your cooldown reversal, I'd imagine the reason the cooldown when you put it on is to prevent you from easily removing it instantly to switch back to a fully powered heal because you used it during something you shouldn't, and (again) that trade off is there for a reason: Foresight. So they don't want you instantly clicking it off and tossing out a normal heal after you've chosen to go into Cleric stance (barring right clicking the buff itself of course). Just don't double click it.

And for all these healers saying they're getting flak in the DF for not dpsing... I don't see it. I've had plenty of healers when I tank or dps just stand around and heal. No one says a word. When I'm on my scholar, I'm always stance dancing and dps/healing. Not one word either way. But when I play my WHM, I tend to just chill out healing and rarely dps. I have yet to find someone complaining that I'm not doing my job/dpsing/whatever.

In any content.

Ever.

I'm with Cynfael: If all these healers are running into groups yelling at them for something or other -all- the time, perhaps they are the problem. Either every group they have is bad, or they're the constant bad thing in the group. One is far more likely than the other.

TLR Cleric stance is fine. Don't use it if you don't want to use it. Because frankly, if you're complaining about it you aren't in the top percentage of players that will be doing server first content that the Dev team has said they are factoring healer dps into.

[sharazisspecial]

Really the game is designed around 0.05% of players? Probably even less then that?

Cleric stance is easy to use (especially because fights are so scripted) but just very clunky.They should fix the clunkiness.
It is more clunky for Whm and probably AST then it is for SCH. Its not hard to use cleric stance stop being elitist about it.

Healer DPS is now mandatory ,when it previously wasn't.
Previously instead of healers CHOOSING to throw out a "bonus" amount of extra DPS in exchange for dealing with CS clunkiness, Healer now must do extra dps in Hard mode raids.

[Verdan]

It's not that it's hard to use, it's that it's balanced as a trade off. You can't heal nearly as well in Cleric stance, with the exception of a few abilities that would otherwise be used to heal up quickly. This means that healers must know when they need to heal and when they don't need to in order to do damage properly. If damage spells were scaled off of mind, it would mean that healers would never have to learn when not to be in cleric stance, as well as being very difficult to balance because of high healing output existing at the same time as high damage output. This is also why there is a cooldown upon application, so that you are punished if you decide it's time to start attacking at a time you're not able to.

[SpookyGhost]

Cleric Stance reminds me of Defiance on WAR. If you choose to go into it, you've gotta be sure that you can go at least 5s (2 GCDs) without casting a heal. I can understand wanting to be able to freely go in and out of it, but 5s isn't that long and it at least makes you more aware of when it's safe to use it and when it's not (can't just go in and out every GCD).

Previously instead of healers CHOOSING to throw out a "bonus" amount of extra DPS in exchange for dealing with CS clunkiness, Healer now must do extra dps in Hard mode raids.

Feel like you're misusing "clunky" or something. If you recognize that you can go 2 GCDs without healing, turn on CS. Cast 2+ DPS spells, turn it off, go back to healing whatever damage needs healing (which doesn't put CS on CD, bare in mind). I dunno what's clunky about that tbh.

[Raminax]

Wow. 15 pages in a day? That has to be some kind of Healer Forum record lol

It was actually more until a whole bunch of posts were removed because they spent more time insulting each other rather than arguing.

[sharazisspecial]

Cleric Stance reminds me of Defiance on WAR. If you choose to go into it, you've gotta be sure that you can go at least 5s (2 GCDs) without casting a heal. I can understand wanting to be able to freely go in and out of it, but 5s isn't that long and it at least makes you more aware of when it's safe to use it and when it's not (can't just go in and out every GCD).


Feel like you're misusing "clunky" or something. If you recognize that you can go 2 GCDs without healing, turn on CS. Cast 2+ DPS spells, turn it off, go back to healing whatever damage needs healing (which doesn't put CS on CD, bare in mind). I dunno what's clunky about that tbh.

Occasionally it doesn't turn off when you press it after a cast. Like, the first button press doesn't register.

[Hiragawa]

Really the game is designed around 0.05% of players? Probably even less then that?

Cleric stance is easy to use (especially because fights are so scripted) but just very clunky.They should fix the clunkiness.
It is more clunky for Whm and probably AST then it is for SCH. Its not hard to use cleric stance stop being elitist about it.

Healer DPS is now mandatory ,when it previously wasn't.
Previously instead of healers CHOOSING to throw out a "bonus" amount of extra DPS in exchange for dealing with CS clunkiness, Healer now must do extra dps in Hard mode raids.

Yes, mandatory use of it is indeed around those players. From the first posts quote "This is also one of the reasons we decided to implement both a normal and savage version of Alexander. Once again, healer DPS was not included in the development team's calculation as it was for other jobs, so you should just think of healer DPS as a last way to get your overall party's DPS up to where it needs to be. "

Last way. LAST WAY. That flat out implies that it's still a choice. Yoshi has flat out stated that it's factored in for those people doing savage and the like world firsts. If you aren't doing a world first and don't like it, don't use it.

And as to your later post that it doesn't shut off... that really bites. Because I don't have that happen. You -may- have some minor input lag, and I can totally understand that being a bloody pain

[sharazisspecial]

It happens to sprint/swiftcast as well , occasionally first press wont register. Maybe its because i am EU although my ms is only 100.

So you can see why i think current cleric stance is clunky...

Last way. LAST WAY. That flat out implies that it's still a choice. Yoshi has flat out stated that it's factored in for those people doing savage and the like world firsts. If you aren't doing a world first and don't like it, don't use it.

You dont need extra dps if you outgear content? How surprising.

[Hiragawa]

You don't -need- extra -healer- dps if your not trying to do stuff on day one/base gear level/on the learning curve (This isn't hard to understand). You're right, it's not surprising. This same exact conversation about dps could be had about optimizing tanks to do more dps rather than take less damage for the perfect push. Is it handy to have? Yes. Is it needed? No.

And as sad as it is, input lag isn't something they should change mechanics for. I'm sorry it's clunky to you, but it works just fine for many others. Same with sprint and swiftcast. It sucks, but it's hardly the skills fault.

[sharazisspecial]

DPS sometimes lose to the DPS check even before Heavenwards so Healers probably need to DPS more regardless in Heavensward.

I don't think savage mode heavensward will be as cheap as it was now. Especially since very few do savage mode
IMO it seems like hard mode alex will be easier to clear then normal coil was.