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  1. #2051
    Player
    Psycofang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    287
    Character
    Void Fang
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 100
    I think we, 'll fall into the same tiers except smn won't be completely outclassed.

    Our single target has definitely gone upbut so has a few other classes. The chains moved but the links are mmostly the same imho.
    (0)

  2. #2052
    Player
    Aikaal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    936
    Character
    Aikaal Leyma
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 90
    Selene, Skill Speed > Spell Speed Rotation please. Makes a better use of our time for Enochian. having Selene and Leylines up at the same time sounds really fun. What if your first rotation is like 20 seconds and you cast Blizzard IV.... Lost 10 Seconds of Enochian.
    (2)

  3. #2053
    Player
    OneWingedSora's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    507
    Character
    Mala Liath
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Aikaal View Post
    Selene, Skill Speed > Spell Speed Rotation please. Makes a better use of our time for Enochian. having Selene and Leylines up at the same time sounds really fun. What if your first rotation is like 20 seconds and you cast Blizzard IV.... Lost 10 Seconds of Enochian.
    Opener is gonna be more than 20 seconds with that much MP and the low MP cost of Fire IVs.
    (2)
    Kairi™

  4. #2054
    Player Skeith-Adeline's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    1,051
    Character
    Sariena Adeline
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 90
    Oh man... Raging, BV Foe's, Trick Attack, Enochian buff, Ast damage buff... 8k flare crits plz. Hopefully the trade-off of our already limited and improvised movement for the damage boost is worth it.
    (0)

  5. #2055
    Player
    Sleigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,563
    Character
    Philia Felice
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWingedSora View Post
    Opener is gonna be more than 20 seconds with that much MP and the low MP cost of Fire IVs.
    Going off the numbers from the video:

    3s cast times (T2, F4, B4): 2.37ish
    2.5s cast times: 1.94ish
    Can assume 3.5s cast times would be 2.7ish

    Sampling probably the longest potential opener, which I'm not advocating will be best before we test but just gonna throw the timeline out there:

    Leylines > B3 > T2 (T1 probably not helpful here, would be very fast and probably no tick) > F3 > Sharpcast > F1 > F4 > F3 > F4 > F4 > F4 > SC Flare > F4 > B3: 28.99s, could Enochian pre-Leylines sometime after B3 and be able to get in your B4 probably even counting the animation times of Leylines and Swiftcast. If not Enochian would be sometime later. Pot would go ... somewhere, might have to do RS > hard pot after F3 which would add about half a second to the rotation

    Something like this would be a lot shorter (not sure if this is actually possible MP wise but it should be, otherwise subtract a F4 or F1): Sharpcast F1 > F3 > F4 > F4 > F1 > F4 > F4 > SC Flare > F4 > B3: 21.55s + a little bit for pot and possibly a Firestarter somewhere

    So I do believe yes you'd be over 20s with pretty much any opener, but it's true, the closer to 30s the better, since that means the closer Enochian will be to being ready to use again once you've dropped it. The long opener I listed probably would need fine tuning for it to be viable but it can't get any longer really.

    Also I advocate Skill > Spell just like Aik. Definitely a raid DPS gain, as sad as it is for us BLMs doing our RS at that point. I hate it but I can't be selfish Also probably losing Foe's if MCH > BRD so it'll be even less strong to start with Spell over Skill.
    (0)
    Last edited by Sleigh; 06-06-2015 at 04:24 AM.

  6. #2056
    Player
    OneWingedSora's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    507
    Character
    Mala Liath
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by Sleigh View Post
    Also I advocate Skill > Spell just like Aik. Definitely a raid DPS gain, as sad as it is for us BLMs doing our RS at that point. I hate it but I can't be selfish Also probably losing Foe's if MCH > BRD so it'll be even less strong to start with Spell over Skill.
    My post was never about what's optimal for raid DPS. It was about what our numbers would look like with the perfect setup. Probably something I would go for after progression when going for personal parses.
    (0)
    Kairi™

  7. #2057
    Player
    Aikaal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    936
    Character
    Aikaal Leyma
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWingedSora View Post
    My post was never about what's optimal for raid DPS. It was about what our numbers would look like with the perfect setup. Probably something I would go for after progression when going for personal parses.
    But in progression and it's proven right now. Skill Speed pull is superior to Spell Speed. It sucks for BLMs but Skill Speed makes warrior/monk/ninja/dragoon really potent. They get more than you.

    It's simple for Heavensward, you can maximize your 30 secs Enochian with only Leylines, I'd rather have spell speed after for the 25 seconds and 20 seconds. This is a better use of Enochian so it will most-likely be the better DPS choice.
    (2)

  8. #2058
    Player
    pandabearcat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,517
    Character
    Alizebeth Bequin
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    It doesn't really suck for BLM, you lose at most 1 fire out of RS, which is ... very, very miniscule on the grand scheme of things.
    (0)

  9. #2059
    Player
    Sleigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,563
    Character
    Philia Felice
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by pandabearcat View Post
    It doesn't really suck for BLM, you lose at most 1 fire out of RS, which is ... very, very miniscule on the grand scheme of things.
    You'd lose 1 Fire with BV + RS + pot. It can be a change to your parse, especially with a crit. That, and whatever is picked first for Skill or Spell, has a very realistic chance of having a whole extra session over the other type (IE in a 1m30s fight that'd be 1 minute of skill, 30s of spell), or at least a partial. At best a fight ends with even uptime for both, at worst it's even less than this form of uptime because if there's a phase change and both are recharging, skill gets priority.

    Regardless, as we've mentioned, it's for the greater good so who cares.
    (0)
    Last edited by Sleigh; 06-06-2015 at 11:42 AM.

  10. #2060
    Player
    pandabearcat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1,517
    Character
    Alizebeth Bequin
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    Yes but say, say that you miss out on literally 1000 damage from that one lost buff on fire.

    On a 5 min fight, doing 500 dps, you will lose...0.7% dps, which is ...3 dps.

    Yea.

    I just wanted to point out how little your opener matters. Getting more procs and being tighter with your overall rotation is far more significant.

    You are right in that they may get another set of ss boost, but even then the dps difference is not going to be that significant.
    (1)

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