The whole Summoner "has been re-worked" is sad

[Dererk]

The could rework summoner like this get rid of the whole pet system and no you can still summon it cause well looks and here's the idea.

Pet will be tied to smn like right behind them like 2 feet behind them no more hp for them.

Smn will gain different ability's based on what pet is out would have to rework Titan but why dose any one really need a pet for tanking.

Once one pet is out you get a number of stacks called something along the line of lets call it evokers wrath for now to use a egis assigned ability they must use one stack of evokers wrath yes you need to select it no more setting them on sic. Once all stacks of evokers wrath are depleted the egi will vanish.

once the egi vanishes you will get a 30 second debuff called lets call it evokers calm can't re summon in this state start making use of you arcanist spells people.

Once evokers calm is down you will gain a 5 second buff called evokers rebirth you can quik summon a egi with out the cast bar.

I think these changes could build a real summoner and make better use of swapping the egis there by making them more useful. Then every one can have the summoner that this great game deserves.

[Duelle]

Between Bahamut and Chakra stacks, I think someone on the developer team has just discovered secondary resource stacks and seems to like it very much. Except it's not something you're supposed to give to every class because it doesn't help separate classes mechanically...

Fixing Summoners shouldnt be hard.

1. Let bane spread dots to all mobs, not a limit of 3, the new tri-diaster did NOT mention a AOE aspect
2. Get rid of Miasma 2's melee range requirement.
3. Make Shadow flare better, more damage or an added effect
4. Make contagion a SMN spell, not a pet spell
5. Give the Egis either more health or better durability, they should not drop dead during every boss fight nor should I have to manually move them around the battlefield

Well, the target limit is probably to prevent obscene DPS jumps (which is what normally happens with classes with DoTs that can spread said DoTs to any and all mobs in range). I agree with Miasma II. Also with Contagion becoming a SMN spell (really, why hasn't this been done yet?).

Also, if the developers of FF11 can find a way to have 13 summons and 8 elementals, I dont get why these developers can't do the same. Look at Warcraft for example, their Warlocks are basically the same class and they have what 7 demons all with different uses?

This is the route I expected them to take with egis. I would limit SMN to the 6 elemental egis (Ifrit, Garuda, Titan, Leviathan, Ramuh, Shiva) and then start adding the custom skins/glamours. Egi ability count is fine and should have been left alone, because all you're doing is removing the ability to add more egis in the future (again, SMN is missing 3 egis).

Assuming Titan is Voidwalker, Garuda is Imp, Ifrit is Felguard, SMN is missing Felhunter (melee-range debuffer/silencer), Succubus (melee-range CC), and something like Infernal (pet with a damage aura).

[Raeletta]

I absolutely and completely don't get why people are so angry. The bahamut invocation looks pretty cool.

As for blah blah rotations, bin them, bin all thought about it. Everyone is going to have to rework their rotation at 60, it's no surprise and until we see the effects ourselves we cannot judge the effectiveness.

as for Tri-Bind and tri-Disaster, the former gets a better name, the latter will assumably be best used when your dots are about to fall off or as a nearly instant bane/fester combo (Yes, this is a rotation thought, but not a QQ my rotation one).

[Evangela]

not only that SMN needs a gameplay rework. this job needs an appearance rework too. scrap the whole Egi and give them real summons.

[Dyvid]

I absolutely and completely don't get why people are so angry. The bahamut invocation looks pretty cool.

As for blah blah rotations, bin them, bin all thought about it. Everyone is going to have to rework their rotation at 60, it's no surprise and until we see the effects ourselves we cannot judge the effectiveness.

as for Tri-Bind and tri-Disaster, the former gets a better name, the latter will assumably be best used when your dots are about to fall off or as a nearly instant bane/fester combo (Yes, this is a rotation thought, but not a QQ my rotation one).

Because it's a pet class? Key word pet.

[Akiza]

All the skills for Summoner as well as other jobs won't be shown until E3 which is a few days before early access. Bahamut Invocation is cool since it adds bursts.

[niwaar]

It is clear by some of your complaints that you did not listen as carefully as you should have so lets look at them closer. Maybe part of your confusion was because they insist on using a translator that clearly has no clue about the subject matter. They should have just let Ben translate it all. (poor guy)

If tri-diaster lived up to its name, it would be too powerful, so they made it a lolspell... you will get "tri-diaster" which will put 3 dots up at once

You honestly see this as a bad thing? To me its something that can be a bad thing or a good thing. It all depends on one thing... The Resource it requires to cast. If the new Tri-Disaster is another Aetherflow charge then it really isn't as good as advertised.

No new egis, current egis will get more abilities.

No new egis, correct. Egis getting more abilities... not so much. They clearly stated that instead of working on new egis with "similar abilities" they were giving the summoner more abilities themselves. This is a GOOD thing. Yes, our pets really do need a huge rework. Contagion needs to be a summoner ability and not a pet ability. But instead of adding Levi, Shiva and Ramuh-egi's with pretty much the same abilities only reskinned, they focused on giving us interesting abilities for us and not more abilities to our Condiment Turret. Instead we are being promised what basically boils down to "Pet Glamours" to come in the future (hopefully 3.1). If done correctly, this will be awesome. A lot of former XI summoners long for our blue squirrel back. Others of us remember the days of running around with Ramuh, Titan, or Garuda in tow. Mabe we will get cool looking "avatars" instead of egi's.

While you attack you will gain "Bahamaut Aether Stacks" and after so many stacks you spend them to have Bahamaut basically take possession of you and you will be able to use some of his direct attacks.

A lot of the community saw this coming.. Well not this exactly, but we have been seeing the writing on the wall since 2.4 and Lady Iceheart and then again with Phoenix(t12). A widely held belief was we were not going to get new pets but we were going to get the ability to channel Primal power in someway. I will be honest, I would have rather seen them let us choose our Primal. But being able to Ahk Morn is going to be pretty nice.

Fixing Summoners shouldnt be hard.

1. Let bane spread dots to all mobs, not a limit of 3, the new tri-diaster did NOT mention a AOE aspect
2. Get rid of Miasma 2's melee range requirement.
3. Make Shadow flare better, more damage or an added effect
4. Make contagion a SMN spell, not a pet spell
5. Give the Egis either more health or better durability, they should not drop dead during every boss fight nor should I have to manually move them around the battlefield.

I dont disagree with you on most of these things. Well... #2 is just dumb. Miasma 2 is designed to be an AoE used at melee range. Either you like it or you don't but its exactly what it should be. Shadow Flare is the exact opposite. Its only problem is its cast time and the fact that the Added Effect: Slow doesnt work on anything of real importance. Slow in fact is not nearly as powerful as it should be. Blind and Slow need to be reworked but thats not a SMN issue thats a larger game design issue.

Your final comments about how they can't add pets that all have different ueses.. Well I agree with you here. But there is something extremely clear to me (and I think to a lot of other players). Quite simply, they simply do not understand how to create pets that work well in this game without them simply being Turrets. When the expansion comes out, we will have 3 pet classes, the pets will be, Ranged Turret (garuda), Melee Turret (Ifrit/Titan), Healer Turret (Eos/Selene), Ranged Turret (Machinist). They are all simply turrets. In XI we had Avatar's that each had its own flavor based on their element. That game had elements that mattered. XIV does not. I am not here to defend the Devs. I want this as much as you do. I miss running around with my Ramuh hitting stuff with Chaotic Strike while my other friend was using Levi and Spinning Diving things to death. XI had very little PvE balance and had no "real" PvP. YoshiP has a belief that everything needs to be as balanced as possible. So we are only going to get turrets.

As for WoW... well to be honest Warlock pets have little "flavor" moves but they are there for certain reasons. The AoE Turret, The Fireball Turret, the Melee Turret. They have a lot more flavor and cool factor than Egi's ever will for sure. But thats because they are the real demons and not fake avatar's like Egis. If you want to complain about something go back to that age old complaint.

I'm not drinking the Kool-Aid. I loved what I saw today, but what we saw was extremely minor and didn't explain anything (unless you are a black mage, which most summoners are after FCOB anyways. :/) I'm torn at the moment. Today's "peak" (because it was just a peak and not what any of us really wanted. Please Bayohne do a Duty Commenced and give us a more in depth look at all the jobs, it is time!) caused me to have a second thought about my plan to move back to tanking full time. I don't want to, but if we are going to be relegated to the bottom again and don't have anything "new and fun" then tanking it is.

[VanilleFang]

you do and like all but 1 FF game they are worthless.

Eeeh... More like 5.

FFVII they are pretty powerful (Knights of the Round...).
FFVIII they are powerful, used for junctioning, and can be used to tank damage.
FFIX they can be incredibly powerful, and Garnet/Dagger's Trance makes them more useful (Atomos is broken if you have enough Amethyst).
FFX they are incredibly powerful and are useful for killing anything too powerful for your regular characters. They are like super charged, OP party members.
FFXIII they are useful for knocking Turtles down so you can spam Death with Vanille for easy wins (also fully healing your party is awesome).

[Duelle]

But instead of adding Levi, Shiva and Ramuh-egi's with pretty much the same abilities only reskinned

Again, drawing on Warlock design, they wouldn't be the same abilities. Felhunters, for example, had an ability that dispelled buffs on their target and an ability that interrupted spellcasting. In FFXIV terms, you could have Leviathan-egi do this, dispelling stuff like protect and stoneskin off player characters in PvP while in PvE they would be able to interrupt caster mobs along with BRD and PLD.

By comparison, Succubus's main draw was the ability to CC using Seduction, a channeled effect that incapacitated the target. Assuming you want charm, this would be perfect for Ramuh-egi (Ramuh EX already does something like this). If you just want it to be a CC thing then Shiva-egi would be fine too (a channeled ability that traps the target in ice). There was and still is room for utility and other egi's. It's regrettable that they haven't gone that route.

[Shougun]

Like Duelle points out, I feel like they're cutting a few useful pet types, but they could still add those types in the future or I suppose clump a whole bunch of utility into one archetype (which is uh.. hmm? lol) .

The new spells were certaintly super flashy and the Egi glamour gives prospect to maybe a few more "fancier summons", and that sounds good. Don't know why it is so popular to say but most, and I've read a lot of these egi threads, do not want "planet sized, 4k texture, 10 trillion poly" egis lol. Personally would like to see esper like Egi glamour (FFXII), if lore can explain the significant visual difference.