Game is not very social to me wether in a FC or not

[Zorvan]

YOU have to be social. You can't expect the people to come to you. We see this from time to time in our FC. Someone quits because they never felt included when they themselves never spoke up in the FC and never made themselves a part of the community. MMOs are what you make of them. If you don't try then you don't get anything at all.



They can buy a keyboard. Just like every Pc player has so that's no excuse.

That's like demanding a PC player buy a controller just like every console player has. An argument that doesn't get you very far in either case.

[Koenignovi]

That's like demanding a PC player buy a controller just like every console player has. An argument that doesn't get you very far in either case.

Well if you want the full experience you'd buy the extra peripheral to enjoy all that the product has to offer. It's like someone complaining that guitar hero sucked because they had to play on controller.

I have to agree with Tiggy that you make the game Social. Just because a group doesnt include you into things doesnt make them less social. You never spoke up in the first place. Say you need to do something, encourage people to do it with you. Dont expect the help to come flying to you, fly to it! Rather than saying "I need help with this run, someone help me." Say it like this "I am going to run this, does anyone need it too?" Or just go and PF for it. I'm sure by the time you have a full group, you've at least said "Hello!".

[Teuciont]

How so? In what way have they made this game less social able? You as a player have a chat log, the ability to talk to others in several different ways. The forums and FC forums enable players to keep in touch. I'm not sure what all the flaws are that you mention.

Yes, you're given the basic tools to communicate but are given little to no incentive while leveling to actually socialize. In the olden days of online gaming, the friends you made on your way to level cap provided you with the group of people that you would experience the level cap content with. That isn't the case anymore. You've listed off nothing more than ways to communicate. My point had everything to do with how the game itself is designed. A player has no reason to socialize from 1-50, and once they hit 50 they're hit hard in face with the reality that they need to socialize. The game punishes a new player upon hitting 50 for not socializing, despite having never made it clear to them that they needed to in the first place. The entire situation of modern MMOs reeks of hypocrisy in design.

[Koenignovi]

Yes, you're given the basic tools to communicate but are given little to no incentive while leveling to actually socialize. In the olden days of online gaming, the friends you made on your way to level cap provided you with the group of people that you would experience the level cap content with. That isn't the case anymore. You've listed off nothing more than ways to communicate. My point had everything to do with how the game itself is designed. A player has no reason to socialize from 1-50, and once they hit 50 they're hit hard in face with the reality that they need to socialize. The game punishes a new player upon hitting 50 for not socializing, despite having never made it clear to them that they needed to in the first place. The entire situation of modern MMOs reeks of hypocrisy in design.

From 1 to 50 I spoke to many people, in and out of DF/PF. Never did I feel like I was a lone. If I had a question about my class/job, I would ask people in LS/FC for advice. I would even ask people I didn't even know what they were doing for the class/job I saw them playing on. Again, I reached out to people to make that socialization happen. I wasn't pushed by the game to make it happen. You expect the game to push players into social ques, it is... You are flung into a dungeon with 3-23 random strangers... Break the ice, say something...

I started playing this game with three other friends when it was re-released. We all had a great time up to our 50s. We even found additional comrades getting there. So I don't see how leveling up is so bad for people in this game. Maybe they just assume one or more people are going to see an injured or weary puppy on the side of the road and pick it up... And if that's the case... dang, we have a lot of lonely puppies...

In a slightly different direction, I think outside information on the game makes people assume they can get stuff done solo. Being that the info on gear, stats, battles, etc, are all readily available, players fly to it before asking others for insight which hinders that meta channel. I mean, it's just an observation... Don't think that's the games fault, more of a community thing.

[Rendecrow]

The game isn't designed around being a very social experience in the first place. Modern MMOs tend to cater towards a "convenient" playstyle rather than a social one, so your average player is left with not much to show by the time they're 50. It's an incredibly flawed way to design a MMO, but it's the ironic reality we have.

And how would you design the MMO then? No duty finder or single player quests to force people to be social and make their own groups???? Then suddenly a large part of the playerbase does not do dungeons and hates questing. The game would find itself hurt in other ways.

I by no means suggest that everything needs to be anti-social and solo content, but just because something is "social" does not necessarily make it better.

[Teuciont]

1-50 with little to no interaction with anyone on their server outside of FATE parties in the 40s. And as for your claim that people assume they can get stuff done solo, it's because they can. There is absolutely nothing from 1-50 that requires a new player to socialize on their own server. You're actually DISCOURAGED to seek people from your own server as the quests tell you to use the Duty Finder. There's not even a hinting on by SE that you might want to recruit locally because there's honestly no point. When you begin to cater to the crowd that just wants to login for an hour every night and get something done, you shed any form of socialization. It's the tradeoff of convenience, which the MMO community has chosen.

[Varilae]

I by no means suggest that everything needs to be anti-social and solo content, but just because something is "social" does not necessarily make it better.

Ignoring the rest of your post, you have to keep in mind this is a MMO. An MMO NOT being social sounds extremely counter-productive don't you think?

[Zabuza]

Idk what you're talking about, this game is extremely social. See all the /tells I got?

Constant social activity!

[Teuciont]

And how would you design the MMO then? No duty finder or single player quests to force people to be social and make their own groups???? Then suddenly a large part of the playerbase does not do dungeons and hates questing. The game would find itself hurt in other ways.

I by no means suggest that everything needs to be anti-social and solo content, but just because something is "social" does not necessarily make it better.

Making the main story synonymous with the best way to level is what has created this problem. If players want to progress their character at a reasonable pace, they are forced to go through the MSQ. Personally I don't feel hand-held questing as the main source of experience points has ever been a good idea in MMOs. In an ideal situation a person would be able to level at whatever pace they choose and experience the story at a different pace, also of their own choosing. I'm painting a target on myself here, but look at FFXI for a good idea of how this used to work. Am I endorsing grinding open world mobs as the holy grail of MMO leveling? No, I feel that things like FATEs, leves, guildhests, and dungeons all provide a role that the MSQ had no place taking for a person's first leveling experience.

[Koenignovi]

1-50 with little to no interaction with anyone on their server outside of FATE parties in the 40s. And as for your claim that people assume they can get stuff done solo, it's because they can. There is absolutely nothing from 1-50 that requires a new player to socialize on their own server. You're actually DISCOURAGED to seek people from your own server as the quests tell you to use the Duty Finder. There's not even a hinting on by SE that you might want to recruit locally because there's honestly no point. When you begin to cater to the crowd that just wants to login for an hour every night and get something done, you shed any form of socialization. It's the tradeoff of convenience, which the MMO community has chosen.

I suppose. I never really thought of the game telling me to look away from the people around you. I honestly thought it a means to get started. If that is not a good way of getting started, how would you go about making it so?

I don't imagine you NOT using DF but it does sound like you're against using it. Do you have others group up with you just so you can have them push the DF button for you? All while you stay quiet hoping they understand your implication?