Gold Saucer outfits, gender locked?

[Krr]

So you're arguing how an iconic outfit, made famous by a very masculine ladies-man romantic type character, being worn by any female PC, is not only out-of-place and unacceptable by players who enjoyed that character, but IN GAME lore as well?

dude what? no
i'm saying that other characters' reactions to faris's appearance or gender is not relevant to his, her, or their existence as a character that is considered to be at the very least 'cross-dressing' by the game lore itself, only the fact that the game lore explicitly states that she is crossdressing multiple times. faris also presents/is presented as female by the story on multiple occasions. faris literally does not conform to binary gender norms as stated by the game, which makes it a theme in at least one of the classical final fantasy titles

Neither Cloud nor Kuja have ANYWHERE CLOSE the same character as Setzer, why are you even trying to make this comparison?

because you are trying to assert that gender nonconformity ('cross dressing') is somehow an inappropriate theme for the final fantasy universe, and I am telling you that it is very appropriate and in-theme for the final fantasy universe, and therefore giving women a suave gambler man jacket to represent their cool, suave, masculine sexuality is actually completely in-theme.

there are women who look like men and men who look like women all over the place, and neither is 'inappropriate' to 'game lore' because both have existed in the actual video games themselves for over an entire decade

edit point:
i'm not even saying that a reading of faris as a dude is wrong here but i'm noting that you are at the very least reading faris as transgender by doing so which is a direct contradiction of your very own idea of innate masculine/feminine sexuality that makes men or women wearing certain clothes 'inappropriate' or 'insulting' cuz multiple characters do in fact read faris as female regardless of what he/she/etc has to say on the matter

so i mean
which is it

[Nalien]

Neither Cloud nor Kuja have ANYWHERE CLOSE the same character as Setzer

Cloud and Setzer are actually fairly similar, and given both their outfits are being introduced the comparison is apt. How much of Final Fantasy VII was dedicated to Clouds emotional scars he earned during his time in SOLDIER? Here you are complaining Setzers outfit is only for men while ignoring a similar outfit being dolled out for everyone.

[Ippiki]

faris literally does not conform to binary gender norms as stated by the game, which makes it a theme in at least one of the classical final fantasy titles

What? No, being a female, and being treated as a male for all of your past, including clothing, isn't non-binary at all. Female is female, no matter how she dresses, but in Faris' case, to virtually everyone she met, she was male.

because you are trying to assert that gender nonconformity ('cross dressing') is somehow an inappropriate theme for the final fantasy universe

I'm saying that, in context of our Setzer outfit discussion, Faris is not a good example for why it should be unisex.

Do the two characters exhibit the similar, masculine traits? Yes.
Do the two characters wear very similar clothing? Yes.
Are both characters treated as male for very long periods of time? Yes, which is my main point. It's not a woman wearing a man's clothing, it's a man who turns out for have been a female.

Do you see the difference here? It's not that there's something wrong with females exhibiting Setzer-like qualities, it's that wearing the outfit doesn't make sense within context of the gamespace, or from a thematic perspective.

Cloud and Setzer are actually fairly similar

Cloud wearing a princess outfit for one section of the game =/= Cloud is transgender, please
Cloud does exhibit masculine traits, but none so overt as Setzer, see above

[Nalien]

I find it hilarious how you think 20 years of non-played exposition on Faris' backstory is somehow relevant to almost the entire game. Seriously, where is this Final Fantasy V prequel where this exposition is somehow relevant?

Cloud wearing a princess outfit for one section of the game =/= Cloud is transgender, please
Cloud does exhibit masculine traits, but none so overt as Setzer, see above

Who's talking about Cloud cross-dressing? I'm talking about his "manly" outfit being added to this game as something female characters can wear. That being fine but Setzers being unacceptable marks you as a hypocrite among other things. Are you the head of the Setzer fanboy club or something? You seem really intent on maintaining his masculinity despite the fact that it isn't in any danger whatsoever...

[Krr]

Cloud wearing a princess outfit for one section of the game =/= Cloud is transgender, please

things I didn't ever actually say part the second

Do you see the difference here? It's not that there's something wrong with females exhibiting Setzer-like qualities, it's that wearing the outfit doesn't make sense within context of the gamespace, or from a thematic perspective.

okay, but now we have a cloud strife costume that's unisex and cloud strife is, again, considered one of the most masculine characters in the series

in a couple of months tops girls will literally be able to be cloud strife, who is one of the most masculine fantasies out there

also like fact check here: literally every character after the one hour mark of final fantasy V genders faris as female, and yet faris doesn't suddenly change their clothes, mannerisms, or appearance in any way except for a couple of scenes where they show up as a princess.

i'm seriously honestly, genuinely baffled as to how you can come to the (categorically) revolutionary idea that faris can be a man and expect to be treated as a man even despite what other characters throughout gameplay do and say regarding them but that characters within the game who possess similar bodies in FFXIV cannot also do the same

Who's talking about Cloud cross-dressing? I'm talking about his "manly" outfit being added to this game as something female characters can wear.

(that's me, as an assertation that cross-dressing and general gender oddity is a very recurrent theme in the final fantasy series, but I have no idea how that idea somehow got teleported into what you were saying in that post)

[Ippiki]

I find it hilarious how you think 20 years of non-played exposition on Faris' backstory is somehow relevant to almost the entire game.

It's almost like some characters are more than meets the eye, huh. It's like they're well-written or something.

I'm talking about his "manly" outfit being added to this game as something female characters can wear.

It is VERY odd that Lightning/Snow outfits were not unisex since this one is, but considering Cloud's massive icon status almost eclipsing the rest of the FF series, the fact this is a veteran reward and not an in game reward and thus has to be applicable to ANY PC, and that he really has no female equivalent to have a male/female dichotomy like with the FFXIII event(maybe Tifa?), I can see it.

[Krr]

It's almost like some characters are more than meets the eye, huh. It's like they're well-written or something.

did we....did we play the same final fantasy five

faris' gender is literally used once as a one-off gag and never actually has relevance again, most of the characters just flatly state what their next objective is, and in the most recent official translation of the game, the main villain utters the phrase "PREPARE THE GIANT MIRROR" in complete seriousness

[Ippiki]

things I didn't ever actually say part the second

Yes, because I wasn't quoting you.

okay, but now we have a cloud strife costume that's unisex and cloud strife is, again, considered one of the most masculine characters in the series
cloud strife is, again, considered one of the most masculine characters in the series

Are you kidding me? He's been the poster boy of downcast, androgynous, spiky-haired anime boys for decades since FFVII's release, and is still portayed that way in rereleases and spinoffs.

literally every character after the one hour mark of final fantasy V genders faris as female, and yet faris doesn't suddenly change their clothes, mannerisms, or appearance in any way except for a couple of scenes where they show up as a princess.

You do understand a person's gender doesn't have to be forefront to everything they do, right? Having her crew/other characters make jokes/call her out on her true gender didn't really change much, she just did what she always does, which is what makes her a interesting character in the first place. Do you hate women or something so much that, when they're portrayed as strong leaders in games, it was only because of her gender status?

[Mandze]

/nonsequiter on

This thread keeps becoming more convoluted, but at least it is about something other than the cash shop or dungeon rage.

/nonsequiter off

[Nalien]

So on top of thinking that perhaps 5 minutes worth of exposition on Faris' upbringing (20 non-existent years) is somehow relevant compared to the entirety of the game we actually play, you also think Clouds outfit is fine because fanbois and there being no female equivalent? Despite suggesting Tifa yourself? Despite Final Fantasy XIII-3 already doing the job by offering Clouds and Aeris' outfit?

Bravo. Stupid, hypocritical, and once again stupid.