I think its time BRD get some loving

[EdgeFayth]

[...]

Its partly due to bard not having any competition for their slot.[...]

This is right for progression.
Once people are on farm and confident, brd spot is just removed, since the boost given to casters by foe is smaller than the difference in dps between a brd and an additionnal nin or mnk.

[alimdia]

Wow this thread is still going?

[Dyne_Fellpool]

swift song IS a support ability. What the hell is it? DPS? No, you use it to aid the speed of your companions outside of combat. How is that not support?

Non-combat uitility =/= combat support. As soon as you bring up DPS, the conversation is about combat balance and Swiftsong is irrelevant.

Bards dont really need more Weapon Dmg. What they should get is slight tweaks to encourage more active singing, more proactive MP management, and a less severe dps penalty for singing.

Support skills like Dragon Kick, Trick Attack, Virus, and Eye for an Eye affect the entire party and incur no dps penalty.

[DoubleD]

Yes i know how much 1 WD is but you havent lost 1 WD, current bard weapons still have 10-11% less WD than other weapons, just as they did when the game launched. This WD nerf you are talking about doesnt exist. I dont know what else to tell you other than look at my post again and try to understand.

I'm saying that percentages don't really matter with small numbers, but this is going to keep increasing.
10-11% WD for every hit adds up.

The actual percentage bards contribute to a fight keeps going down with Ilvl increases - this is very concerning.

I've posted this before, but say a bard does 15% less damage than a DRG.
100000 damage vs 85000 damage.

Longer fights, more boss hp : Dragoon 500000 damage vs 425000 for bard.

It's the same percentage lower than the DRG contributes damage wise, but the damage contributed to the fight is awfully lower. THIS is what's getting worse each patch. They just need to draw a line and say BRD WD is -5 of melee. Not keep on widening the gap in WD because it's bullshit. At this rate, it's gonna be better to be TP starved than have a bard.

"Yo bard, we need you for Ballad / Paeon until everyone is familiar with the fight and doesn't die and healers know the clutch heal spots"
Then get kicked to the curb. It's already happening in extreme maximizer groups.

[Krr]

Once people are on farm and confident, brd spot is just removed, since the boost given to casters by foe is smaller than the difference in dps between a brd and an additionnal nin or mnk.

I haven't seen an actual static that does this since the dawn of 2.0. The group is just able to run without the BRD if the BRD doesn't want to or isn't able to show up, instead of having to wait an hour for a competent pug one to show up in PF. Even if there is a rational reason to kick your BRD out just because "well we have the entire Coil on farm" it's not worth the friction and trouble of finding a new one when they become mandatory again for an extra 10% DPS.

'On farm' also doesn't mean 'TP and MP deficits stop existing'. T4 groups in 2.0 were 'on farm' for weeks and that didn't stop them from needing Foe and Ballad to help the group keep up with DPS and healing sustain checks. Outdated content has this problem for sure, but that crap doesn't matter.

If it's actually happening in 'maximizer' groups, then they aren't maximizing correctly and are an outlier to game balance.

[Mugiawara]

There are no support jobs in this game and Yoshi P has confirmed they're not going to be added any time soon. Thanks for playing.

Yoshi said a lot of things but bards are in fact, a DPS/Support class. Healers are also a support class, we just call them healers lol.
People need to play Bard and learn what it entails. Sorry, it's NOT a FULL DPS class. A lot of these posts make me think a buttload of bards here don't even bother singing
because they're too worried about tons of damage and upset with reductions that help the rest of the party. It's a hybrid, so you're going to get halfies here.

Maybe you should learn more about your SMN and clear coil first, your own job have a fair share of issues.

This is not my main account and I already know the dooms and glooms of SMN and how God awful they are right now. I already have played with Bards in coil as a healer
and they seem okay to me.
With what you said then, SMN needs to be priority then, since Bard isn't as nearly as bad as SMN because they are in a tight spot atm.
[Again don't bother looking into this characters Loadstone or whatever. >>;]

[Ooshima]

Yoshi said a lot of things but bards are in fact, a DPS/Support class. Healers are also a support class, we just call them healers lol.
People need to play Bard and learn what it entails. Sorry, it's NOT a FULL DPS class. A lot of these posts make me think a buttload of bards here don't even bother singing
because they're too worried about tons of damage and upset with reductions that help the rest of the party. It's a hybrid, so you're going to get halfies here.

A buttload of BRDs here who actually suggests something logical and non-game breaking balance (such as +1WD) are actually BRDs who played their job long enough and have conquered FCoB by now.

Maybe you should learn more about your SMN and clear coil first, your own job have a fair share of issues.

[Riepah]

Yoshi said a lot of things but bards are in fact, a DPS/Support class. Healers are also a support class, we just call them healers lol.

So we should let Bards fill the same roles in DF as healers, because they're all support classes, right?

[GalkaBikini]

So, since my coil group is 2 SMNs and a BRD (formerly 2 BRDs 1 SMN) and a NIN, that makes us super amazing right?

[SirionArmar]

I'm a bard main, recently cleared t13 a few weeks back. I for one see no reason to remove the song penalty or boost WD whatsoever. One of the first things told to you in the Archer's guild is that arrows do not pack the punch of spears or sword, but the mobility, lack of positionals and party support skills make us a very versatile class that is almost required for progressing through endgame content. While we may not have the highest damage, we can still pull very high numbers when playing our class correctly. I for one can parse 517 dps on dummies (2 mins), can easily hit over 800+ dps on the pull with my cooldown rotation, and I sit at around 440-480 in fcob, which I don't consider very far off from the other dps in my static (Them being MNK, DRG and BLM).

The only gripe I have with the job is having to wait for a gcd to deactivate my songs, delaying an attack. SE please fix, I need those gcds for shooting things D: