NIN Goad - Show BRDs some love

[aisustrong]

isnt nock more tp efficient?

[Alistaire]

isnt nock more tp efficient?

Yes, providing you can hit all the targets with it. That can be either rough to do in some cases, others it's just bards that don't know better.

You have to be something along the lines of god tier luck to get enough procs on the other 2 to even it out.

[Lemuria]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but does Bard really need Goad? I mean, we can equip invigorate for a free 400 TP if we get really low, and unless you're spamming Wide Volley endlessly, you shouldn't be wrecking your TP too badly. Sure, it's good for tackling crowds so a little extra TP is always nice, but Goad isn't particularly fast at recovering it. It's effectively the same as Invigorate but takes 3 minutes to get there.

It would take 9 seconds to earn enough for a Quick Nock, and a full 21 seconds for Rain of Death. I'm not saying its useless, far from it, but it's not going to add much DPS overall since it's unlikely you'll be spamming skills long enough to win enough TP back. At least, not before running dry at least once.

[Its_Elodie]

If I'm doing large pulls on my war and you see me slowing down with my rotation, please goad me. Yeah, it's nice when you have a pld in group so you don't have to worry about their tp too much, but with war it's a lot different IMO. It's not fair to say that we should have to resort to flashing to hold when with str accessories and good gear we dps on our own and use our tp to self heal to help the healers out. Popping foresight and bloodbath with beserk helps give us back hp while we overpower large mobs and with many large pulls its easy to run out. Flashing doesn't do that. We also don't have the crazy defensive cd's plds do so I try to help heals when I can.

[Fated]

I would never Goad a Warrior. A good one doesn't need it.

[vp_cmc]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but does Bard really need Goad?

I'm losing all tp as a bard after a 4 minutes in a single target fight, with invigorate, but when I have 100% uptime on boss (t10, t12 for example). After this I either take goad or have to do paeon just for myself, because others seem still fine on TP.

[Kyros]

Between a Warrior and a BRD? Goad the Warrior. All things equal he'll run dry sooner. This isn't about TP, but about damage. Also, a BRD can easily Paeon himself between pulls, where typically the WAR will be out of range to receive the benefit while he pulls everything.

I would never Goad a Warrior. A good one doesn't need it.

Just because they don't need it doesn't mean they can't use it. A good Warrior will turn that goad into more damage.

[Sammix87]

To be fair to some of the really good and nice people playing NIN's I have been lucky to be given goad when I was dpsing mobs using AoE abilities. TBH I didn't really need it as some of the people have said, its not hard to manage your TP as long as you use your skills properly and so far the fights in WoD are the worst for me TP wise (but then I always get in low dps runs for that so yeah...).

We have armies peon so its not 100% necessary for BRD to get Goad but I do see where your point is coming from. I'd say that it should really be up to the NIN in your party, or maybe if you really desperately need tp and its available try asking? I'm sure most people wouldn't mind.

[aisustrong]

I would never Goad a Warrior. A good one doesn't need it.

i get goaded fairly often in roullete pugs, just makes me use op more often

[Waeksyn]

I'm not a warrior so I'm pretty ignorant about how that job keeps hate on big pulls. I do play PLD, though, and I have no trouble keeping hate on big pulls without access to an effective, TP based crowd enmity skill like overpower. Circle of scorn is a bit of a joke being so weak (even with the recent enmity boost), long recast and small diameter of effect.

In big pull AOE situations, I don't worry about damage at all, just enmity. I Flash until MP gets low then fast blade / riot blade / Flash until about 3 mobs are left at which time I can rotate among the 3 with normal attacks (Fast - Savage - Rage) or continue with FB / RB to build MP back up for the next pull.

With War having access to Flash, they have both an MP based crowd enmity skill and the TP based skill. They don't get a way to recover MP but when MP gets low but can use the TP based Overpower while MP recovers, then go back to Flash while TP recovers. Rinse and repeat.

So, in that scenario, why does WAR need Goad, unless they are focusing on dealing damage rather than enmity control?

As I said, I'm pretty ignorant about how the job is played.