Gearswaps are dead - long live the Jobswaps!

[Jem]

and u wanting to let ppl change classes would hurt the system the ppl want its ur idea that u want them to do thus forcing it on other ppl im not attacking ur idea im just saying ur doing it too

This is false equalization, it's NOT a circler argument.

1) wants the game to stay as it is, and currently it allows you to choose how you play. Micro-manage or don't micro a system with the freedom to choose.

2) wants to get SE to create NEW restrictions that lock you into a certain type of game-play for no other reason then to be exactly that, restrictive. Restrictions that SE has never even made mention they are thinking about or planning to make.

these are NOT equal. i don't know how to explain it any better.

on-topic: I'm having a hard time understanding the opposition to this. Everyone who bought the game signed up for this, the armory system and how it worked has been in the games details even before the alpha, even then some of us talked about how the late game would work and this is it, but the cool thing about this is you can play how you want. Don't want to level another class/job it's your game, don't do it. People are acting like this was something recently added, it has been there all along players have already been using it. Dungeons have just made it more noticeable.

People are also making this out to be Armageddon when it may not even be that bad for the most part, it may just be nice having 2 types of physical Dds if you like physical classes, having a tank setup and a DPS setup, or having a nuker and a healer if you mainly like magic users.

I have a feeling that most players in the late-game, once the game is in full swing and the major fixes have been done and major content starts to roll in, are going to want to rank a few max level classes if for nothing more then a wider options of abilities, and at least 2 jobs just to be able to do something different when they long on day after day. Instead of having skill trees FFXIV has a mostly unrestricted class systems and that's how you make unique characters, but to be more diverse and have even more options.... yes you are gonna have to put some work into it, if you want it, again you choose how to play.

Two things to consider that might make you change your mind about this being bad:

At first no one is going to expect this of people because it will be rare for everyone to have the requirements to do it. but in time even most players are going to get bored with just doing 1 thing and level something new. And second, new classes/jobs WILL be added eventually are you going to what? abandon your max level classes/jobs and make the new ones your "main", or because you can't have more then one class/job you ignore the new ones?

[Rinsui]

1) wants the game to stay as it is, and currently it allows you to choose how you play. Micro-manage or don't micro a system with the freedom to choose.

Still reading your post, but there's already a big misconception. You're not "free to choose" when the party leader decides to accept you based on the number of swaps you are able to perform during one run.

on-topic: I'm having a hard time understanding the opposition to this. Everyone who bought the game signed up for this

No, without dungeons it was not possible to see this coming, and luckily I think the current state (before Jobs are implemented) is just a "dry run". SE actually put in saveguards against gear-swapping that were not in place in FFXI. If that isn't a hint...

At first no one is going to expect this

I guess you missed the party. People are already expecting this ^.^;/

[danny52844]

game sold about 7 million... if even 50% of those people liked it thats about 3 times more then the normal game

it shipped 5mil games most of them sold so ill say 5m copies were sol lets say 50% didnt like it thats only 2.5m happy ppl away from thier high from ff7 that was around 10m happy players

[Rinsui]

it shipped 5mil games most of them sold so ill say 5m copies were sol lets say 50% didnt like it thats only 2.5m happy ppl away from thier high from ff7 that was around 10m happy players

Besides, just like with FFXIV, people possibly simply couldn't believe the initial reviews...
Or they made the mistake to pre-order...

[Jem]

No, without dungeons it was not possible to see this coming, and luckily I think the current state (before Jobs are implemented) is just a "dry run". SE actually put in saveguards against gear-swapping that were not in place in FFXI. If that isn't a hint...

Gear works completely different in FFXIV then it did in FFXI, for FFXIV it basically makes up your base combat stats so because of this you need to upgrade your gear in tiers to become stronger aka upgrading. In FFXI good gear was sometimes good for not only a few levels but sometimes forever, ex. CoP rings that start at level 30 and are still worn by most players at 90, multiple gear sets could be tailored to different things aka sidegrading. So it's not a hint about anything, it's just two different ways of doing gear.

Forgive me for my bluntness but just because "You" didn't see this coming doesn't mean it wasn't possible. myself and others in the FFXI community discussed this game often before release and this exact inevitability was obvious after the armory system was detailed.

@ you editing your post while i was trying to quote it, it was freaking me out at first because the page would refresh and i would reread what i was quoting and it was different LOL

[DNO]

it shipped 5mil games most of them sold so ill say 5m copies were sol lets say 50% didnt like it thats only 2.5m happy ppl away from thier high from ff7 that was around 10m happy players

whoops sorry 5 million idk were i got 7 mil.
Away the point still stands 2.5 million is good. but of course you are right ff7 and 13 huge difference i wont debate that no matter how much i like ff13.

[Alkoun]

At first no one is going to expect this of people because it will be rare for everyone to have the requirements to do it

The problem is people already DO expect this. I wouldn't have a problem with class/job-swapping if it was on my own terms, but it isn't. It's on the terms of the party leader. And yes, people do indeed have the requirements to do it since most people have had more than enough time to exploit the old SP bonus thing with guildleves pre-1.18.

[Jem]

I guess you missed the party. People are already expecting this ^.^;/

hehe yeah i haven't even arrived at the party yet, so i won't argue with you there. I've been interested in this game for years and still am, but I've given it chances and though i really like some of it still fills incomplete so when i say "at first" i kinda mean after the game is finished. Reviewers occasionally used the word "soulless" when describing FFXIV and i have yet to see something that makes me disagree with that. I've had a taste of the FFXIV community and i haven't liked what i see. So, my grand plan is to follow it closely, excite myself about improvements and real content, and to deal with the bad community i will wait it out. the launch of the PS3 version will bring in some new blood at least enough to breath some new air into the player-base.

[Dargoth_Draconia]

Please like this post if you think job swaps during a dungeon run are a cheesy combat mechanic that should not stay.

I really don't think this is a good idea because of how things may play out in the future. You say you don't want it like FFXI? Or am I wrong, by doing this would inevitably make it just like FFXI. Also what if you have 8 people in a dungeon and you play a Conjurer and let's say an Archer. (Stats not being important atm because stats are already being planned to be reworked and with the abolish of physical levels a way to retain independent stats for each individual class will be available). Let us say you came in as an Archer and someone d/c's and doesn't get back on and it's a healer and you are under a time limit. Should your run be screwed? No, you should be able to change your job in the dungeon if you want. Also this goes with the direction of the game of being able to change to whatever class/job you want as long as you are not in battle and to change it would be counter productive.

[Nel_Celestine]

While i can agree with that, lets flip the coin.

Archer seems to be the best DD for this due to being able to stay outside the AoE range and Conjurer helps with healing the tank for rushing to the boss fight. Lets say there now there are two people who want to do the run. One person ONLY has Archer up to Rank50 and the other has BOTH Archer and Conjurer. With the current mind set you will pick the second one and have them swap FORCING the other play to go level a job she/he might not have an interest in JUST so they can participate in a dungeon run.