SE will never succumb to Diablo III official RMT

[Ventus]

This is why:

So the attitude, then, is pretty much "Why try to beat them, when you can just join them"?

The idea is that RMT has no place in the games to begin with. This is why companies like SE continue to fight against it - because they *don't* want it in the game in the first place.

By supporting the idea of a system like this, you're essentially supporting RMT.

That some are looking at it as a "money making opportunity".. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't FFXIV supposed to be a *game*? Something done on one's leisure time for entertainment, not a place for people to open their own personal store front?

Honestly, there are other online worlds for that kind of thing.. Second Life and Project Entropia being two of them. It works fine for those worlds because they're created from the ground up to support such a thing. It's core to their entire design.

FFXIV is not created with the goal of being a "virtual storefront for enterprising gamers".

Needless to say, I disagree with a system like Blizzard's wholeheartedly, 1000%.

Using an example made earlier..."If it takes someone 2 years to get a piece of gear then someone's spending the same amount of money, only they're getting it that much sooner!". Aside from the idea of spending 2 years worth of sub fees on a single in-game item being absolutely ridiculous, this is flawed on several levels...

1) Time and chance are the two equalizers in a system like this. No matter who you are or what walk of life you come from, the game doesn't care... You have the same odds of achieving or acquiring something as anyone else, you have to put the time in to achieve or acquire something like anyone else.

Anyone who wants a piece of gear, or to achieve something, has the same chance of obtaining or achieving it. They have the same in-game resources available to them. They all have to put in the same time and overcome the same obstacles. It's part of what keeps the playing field level for everyone.

Everyone pays the same sub fee, everyone gets the same game.

"But people with more time to play can make more progress and that's not fair!" I can already hear some protest... Being someone, myself, who has less time to play than many, I still strongly disagree with that assessment. It's an argument from entitlement, made by people who feel that somehow having less time to play makes them a 'special case', and entitles them to special treatment; an easier ride. It's not unfair that people with more time to play make more progress... It's common sense. It happens in everything and will happen in everything. Even with the fatigue system in place limiting how much people could level, people with more time to play *still* made more progress in terms of leveling different classes and completing more content.

Allowing for extra time for wipes, etc... if an activity requires about 5 hours of in-game time to complete, some people are going to have 5+ hours available to do it in one shot. Others are only going to have an hour or two at a time, and will have to complete it in parts. At the end of the day, both people have spent about the same amount of in-game time to achieve that goal.

Perhaps if people learned to stop valuing their own play experience only in how it compares to "how far along others are", and start worrying about their own progress and enjoyment instead, this perceived "problem" would go away.

2) A flaw with the quoted line of reasoning is that for 2 years of paid playtime, players are getting access to the *entire game*, not just a single piece of gear. So they are not spending "2 years paying for the item". They are spending 2 years playing the game.

3) People around here seem to hate "elitism", and with good reason. I can't stand it either.

It should be noted that with a system where you can buy gear instead of earning it in-game, you end up replacing one kind of elitism with another... It goes from "those who have the most time get the nicer things first" to "those with the most cash to spend on in-game items get the better gear first... or even at all".

I've spent a notable amount of time in various F2P with Cash Shops, particularly those that sell gear via their cash shops. You better believe that in F2P/Cash Shop games where $$$ spent is a deciding factor, that same "elitism" rears its ugly head. People will not invite you to their raid groups, etc. if you haven't dropped $$$ on those high ticket gear items. You're not "committed" or "serious" enough for them.

Imagine that... being deemed "unworthy" not based on your skill or preparedness as a gamer.. but by how fat your wallet is as a consumer. Yeah. Wonderful idea, that. /sarcasm

In a system where $$$ is that important a factor, should SE decide to take that route, you can bet your ass it would become a problem in this game as well; especially with how caught up people are already showing themselves to be with "optimal setups" for things.

3) Adding a "Buy It Now!" option to acquire items that would otherwise have to be earned by playing the game would only undermine entire portions of the game itself. Why do those quests when you can just buy it outright! Why level crafting and put all the time into creating good gear items when people can just buy them with real $$$! And so forth...

Bringing real world money into a virtual world takes the experience from that of being in a virtual fantasy world *separate* from our own, to becoming a virtual shopping mall with quests and xp that is merely an extension of our own.

I can't think of a better way to completely ruin any sense of being in a virtual world than by having real world $$$ attached to items in the game.

SE's stated in the past that they didn't agree with the RMT path, because it detracts from the game overall... Here's hoping they still hold that position.

Seriously what is it with this trend to monetize video games? Yeah! Instead of having players actually earn things in-game as rewards for *playing*, let's just side-step all that nonsense and attach a price-tag to it instead!

How about we let the experience of playing a game be about the gameplay and not about how much real world $$$ we have to spend on virtual items. Novel idea, isn't it?

Just wanted to show everyone what preypacer said because it makes a lot of sense and can hopefully get people to realize how silly it is to ruin a game with official RMT. It's an evil in many MMOs that ruins the game. So after many attempts to prevent this, regulating it officially in a game will only make that same game breaking organization an official one.

Regarding Diablo III, I actually wanted to play that game until official RMT system was announced. I really hope people don't support this system it's just rediculous to me.

Thanks for reading.

[Jaide]

In my opinion Blizzard already poisoned the MMO genre, so this right up the same alley. You can bet that if they make a ton of money off the transactions you'll see game sanctioned RMT become the norm, just like developers are all scrambling to copy WoW - regardless of the impact it has on the health of the game or the genre. I don't think SE is immune to this mentality, especially after the losses they've taken on FFXIV so far.

I agree with everything quoted in the OP though. I will never play any MMOs that adopt this.

[TheVedis]

we didnt need another thread on this

[weeble]

next step will be allowing any and all 3rd party tools, everyone having them instead of some? same concept then. why let 3groups outclaim everyone with bots ...let us all have them on equal ways. lol ...i don't think i like this idea but i can see ff17 trying to do all of this if diablo succeed. every gaming company would happily milk more money from the populous if they could, that is all they are about.

though i would have to say doing it outright isn't horrible, at least most the players then will either be rmt or won't be, no secret hidden lines between them like there are in most mmo's these days. i've seen billions of bank gils get stolen and leaders running off to sell there accounts leavin ls to his mates, only to come back a month later. lot of shadyness that maybe can be ended.

maybe even prices drop so badly cause every little kid with 10hrs of gameplay after school will be undercutting each other that rmt prices will be next to nothing? i dunno just trying to think of the positive possibilities. but either way all mmo's and gaming for that matter worry me, they are all on a path to milk the customer for every cent they willing to give them, from dlc's to costume packs, and whatever else they can think of that they can charge u for. none of it will change till people just finally say nooo, and of course there be enough people that say it. till then we are on a straight path to this industry sucking eggs.

[Nikita]

Never say never! :P

Who knows what the future of gaming holds? You don't. For better or for worse, it is changing.

[TonyMontana]

In my opinion Blizzard already poisoned the MMO genre, so this right up the same alley. You can bet that if they make a ton of money off the transactions you'll see game sanctioned RMT become the norm, just like developers are all scrambling to copy WoW - regardless of the impact it has on the health of the game or the genre. I don't think SE is immune to this mentality, especially after the losses they've taken on FFXIV so far.
I agree with everything quoted in the OP though. I will never play any MMOs that adopt this.

+100000000

[Rinsui]

RMT or cashshops in -> Rinsui out.
(One of the very few things that could really drive me away forever).
Just not my style of game.

I more readily belive that the organized RMTers will still have an edge above ordinary players even if RMT is legalized, since they can bot-farm 24/7 and coordinate their never-resting efforts. What will happen most likely is that the real money market will be dominated by China, and the money will be sucked out of the pockets of wealthy US buyers.

(Funny how game worlds have come to replicate reality!)

[Preypacer]

This is why:



Just wanted to show everyone what preypacer said because it makes a lot of sense and can hopefully get people to realize how silly it is to ruin a game with official RMT. It's an evil in many MMOs that ruins the game. So after many attempts to prevent this, regulating it officially in a game will only make that same game breaking organization an official one.

Regarding Diablo III, I actually wanted to play that game until official RMT system was announced. I really hope people don't support this system it's just rediculous to me.

Thanks for reading.

Heh, that other thread must have gotten nasty after I posted this morning. Have been at work, so I couldn't follow it, other than a quick glimpse while on a short break.

It's definitely a divisive topic. The way I see it, however, is this... Up until Blizzard announced this new system for Diablo III, no one in XIV - at least that I've seen - even seriously *considered* being able to sell or buy things in this game for real world money. Even if it's been touched upon in the past, it certainly hasn't been a "major topic", as those tend to come up repeatedly.

People were concerned about the the rate of sp, about the difficulty of dungeons, about the amount of content, interface issues, MW issues, etc... things specifically relating to the gameplay and balance. Now all of a sudden, Blizzard makes this announcement, and all of a sudden people are up in arms about it being implemented in FFXIV.

Regarding your statement, Ventus, about how SE's been fighting it... that's another detail that I wonder if people have seriously considered. SE has been aggressively dead-set against RMT, and keeping real-money transactions out of the game. They've gone to great lengths to combat it in FFXI and vowed to do the same in XIV. They said from early on that RMT/MTs was not something they were seriously considering as they see the ways in which it detracts from the game, and makes it instead about how much $$$ people are able to spend.

In light of all that, it would put them in a very precarious and uncomfortable position to suddenly come around and say "Oh hey, remember how we said we were completely against RMT, have been fighting it tooth and nail month after month, and said we'd never implement it into our games? Yeah... Forget all that. We've decided that it's actually A-OK (as long as we're getting a cut), so we're going to officially endorse it now!"

That would completely undermine all their past efforts to combat it, and the outward stance they've had against it all this time.

I realize there are some who wouldn't care about that, because it would suit them personally if SE did so... However, I think they've put themselves in quite enough hot water as it is with how XIV launched in the first place. Essentially re-negging on their own stance in the midst of all that? Not a good idea.

Maybe some years down the road, when FFXIV is past its hey-day and is slowly winding down, like XI is now.. But not at this point. Too many wounds are still too new and open to run the risk of opening yet another one.

Also.. Just to clarify something I said in my post which you quoted.. When I said I was against the system Blizzard is implementing 1000%, I meant in terms of it being implemented in XIV. I really couldn't care less what Blizzard does in their own games anymore. The "Activision" part of Activision Blizzard started becoming apparent some time ago already. This move on their part is just par for the course.

Finally, I share your sentiment.. The moment SE turns that corner and decides to bring real world money into purchasing in-game items... I'm gone as well.

It *sounds* great in theory to say "if you don't like it, just don't buy the items and get them yourself instead..." However, per my personal experience with similar situations in other MMOs... it never pans out that way. The effect of such things becomes too pervasive for anyone to "avoid". Everyone ends up being affected by it in the end.

[Tigercub]

Great post Preypacer!
On the D3 front, I won't be buying the game despite being a huge fan of the first and an avid player of the second. They messed with their formula so badly on so many levels. The RMT decision they made is about an extra 500 nails more than was ever necessary to close up that coffin. I wouldn't touch a game that supports RMT with a 20 foot pole.

[Nipa]

I'd rather have SE with a endorsed RMT market and funds to make more content, that have a empty game where money can't buy power (but where time spent grinding is power).

It's only a matter of balance, like Eve showed us.