If DRG does in fact get a buff...

[Verus]

Any form of proof for consistently pushing 500 DPS in said gear (no melded 110 gear, no iLvl 120+ gear)? Like a video where you open the character screen midfight during the parse? Otherwise I'm pushing 600 DPS with Zenit Gae Bolg in Darklight gear in a fight like T9. Posting bold statements is one thing, but you need to back it up, especially if your claims are far off from what other top DRGs can achieve (not claiming to belong to these circles myself, but from reading these forums, looking on youtube, reddit and searching the internet I couldn't find any single DRG to even be close to those numbers in regular iLvl 110 gear). So you either are the UBER-DRG or your numbers aren't quite correct.

The big problem with most of the drg hate comes bad players and not knowing how to properly make an effective gear set. Most drg probably don't have much 2nd coil gear although that may change now with echo. A full Soldiery drg has way too much skill speed to be viable in a large number of fights. I've only found T6 savage so far to be effective for drg to have SS build. Crit is our main stat for i110.

As far as what everyone has been saying, yes, I should provide evidence. So tell me what would be the most effective fight to demonstrate dps. T8 with turning echo off? A video of a dummy parse? I'll work on making a video of something appropriate sometime tonite. However, I have not seen any proof of a mnk hitting 550+ in fights and it most likely isn't possible with i110 unless they have another mnk DK all the time.

http://i.imgur.com/PpJ1XMV.png?1
Average parse of t10 I believe this was a 1% wipe or something but this was average among our attempts. Did clear by the end of the night. DPS could be higher for me but with charge rng it can fluctuate.

Based on your comment, that makes NIN and MNK the tank right? Since NIN and MNK do more damage than DRG already, so they must be the tanks, right?

NIN and MNK do not have an initial burst like a DRG. We all know this. With a buff in attack potency it will make it easy for DRG to pull only at the beginning and potentially on add phases when they spawn.

That really depends on what the buff is. If they buffed Dragoon's Maguc Defense no. If you lowered CD on say Jump and added some sort of better raid utility, not seeing it there either. The only situation they might is if they directly buff attack potency. However seeing as how SE would likely buff Full Thrust, Vorpol Thrust, and True Thrust if they did, and that is not the opening combo, I'm still not seeing it.

Magic defense is our crutch as drg and a buff in that department would be most welcome.

[Ihm]

NIN and MNK do not have an initial burst like a DRG. We all know this. With a buff in attack potency it will make it easy for DRG to pull only at the beginning and potentially on add phases when they spawn.

I'll agree I spoke without thinking when I said MNK, but you're saying NIN doesn't have an initial burst like DRG? REALLY?

[Vodomir]

A full Soldiery drg has way too much skill speed to be viable in a large number of fights. I've only found T6 savage so far to be effective for drg to have SS build. Crit is our main stat for i110.

Even with a mixed pre-2.4 BiS Set the issue of having too much SS still remains. And as far as I know stat weights say that det is our main secondary stat.

As far as what everyone has been saying, yes, I should provide evidence. So tell me what would be the most effective fight to demonstrate dps. T8 with turning echo off? A video of a dummy parse? I'll work on making a video of something appropriate sometime tonite. However, I have not seen any proof of a mnk hitting 550+ in fights and it most likely isn't possible with i110 unless they have another mnk DK all the time.

T8 with echo probably isn't very representative, so I'd say a dummy parse would serve best. As far as dummy parses are concerned, I've seen Monks and Ninja do 520 DPS in iLvl 110 with 115 weapon (remember, no melded stuff and no 120+ gear).

http://i.imgur.com/PpJ1XMV.png?1
Average parse of t10 I believe this was a 1% wipe or something but this was average among our attempts. Did clear by the end of the night. DPS could be higher for me but with charge rng it can fluctuate.

I actually don't buy that "average" thing, as you've selected one specific encounter. If you wanted to show your average DPS you could as well have selected the all encounter. And your numbers are not actually in the realm of exceptionally high, as I've seen other DRGs post numbers of 450 DPS with iLvl 115 weapon, and those Dragoons weren't even the renowned names on these forums. So this parse doesn't really give me any reason to believe that you actually blow all other Dragoons out of the water.

[siverstorm]

http://i.imgur.com/PpJ1XMV.png?1
Average parse of t10 I believe this was a 1% wipe or something but this was average among our attempts. Did clear by the end of the night. DPS could be higher for me but with charge rng it can fluctuate.

Considering how much HP Imdugud actually has and how much damage it took in that screenshot that was not a 1% wipe lol. Your 1% wipe was probably the 10:41 result which wasn't highlighted. On our attempts during progression my numbers were fairly close and I had no penta'd gear.

We can pull decent numbers but in comparison to a mnk/nin of equal skill/gear it's like night and day. In most pug content I can pull top dps easily but in the raid content where it matters the problem is glaring.

NIN burst is so close to DRG burst that when you couple their sustained damage and their burst vs drg the problem gets even worse.

Going with what Vodomir is saying DET is our goto stat. Our sustained output is problematic as is, even without looking at stat weights. We need all the sustained dps we can get since spike damage from crits is unreliable and the important crits are usually get life surged anyway.

[Houston009]

NIN and MNK do not have an initial burst like a DRG. We all know this. With a buff in attack potency it will make it easy for DRG to pull only at the beginning and potentially on add phases when they spawn.

This right here actualy made me laugh, like NIN doesnt have initial burst? ive died dozens of time by attempting to do my burst right off the back. DRG needs a buff and you know it. NIN has taken their spot and any DRG who isn't blind already hopped on the NIN train because they know it is currently superior.

[Verus]

This right here actualy made me laugh, like NIN doesnt have initial burst? ive died dozens of time by attempting to do my burst right off the back. DRG needs a buff and you know it. NIN has taken their spot and any DRG who isn't blind already hopped on the NIN train because they know it is currently superior.

Again you misunderstand what I said. NIN has initial burst sure. However, every equivalent geared DRG will burst higher side by side. In my video you can see initial burst up to around 600-650 and thats without a potion.

[Ihm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I8DuslkCeUE

Just uploaded a video of what you all ask. With food buff and party buff only, this is what I was able to pull. A potion would make this higher and fights like t8 still potentially can burst higher with trick attack and selene buff at optimal times.

I ask for evidence in equivalent gear on a mnk because the good ones I know cap out at the same dps as me even with 2 i130 gear pcs.

For reference, 3 pcs of i110 crafted seem to add about 30 dps to drg and potions on cd a slight increase.

450 on a 3 minute parse, that's standard for a DRG, nothing special. NIN can do 520+ and MNK 490+. DRG is better though because 450 is higher than 490 and much higher than 520?

Again you misunderstand what I said. NIN has initial burst sure. However, every equivalent geared DRG will burst higher side by side. In my video you can see initial burst up to around 600-650 and thats without a potion.

Looking at the parse you posted, I don't think that your NIN buddy over there is as good of a NIN as you are a DRG.

[Houston009]

Again you misunderstand what I said. NIN has initial burst sure. However, every equivalent geared DRG will burst higher side by side. In my video you can see initial burst up to around 600-650 and thats without a potion.

Ive bursted to 700 on my ninja prior to getting geared. The problem with drg in comparison to mnk and nin is that the only place they shine in is bursting. DRG's sustain is trash compared to mnk's and subpar compared to nin's. In your video you end the parse right after you burst and your video is only a 3min parse which shows nothing in terms of sustained damage on prolonged fights.

[Verus]

Ive bursted to 700 on my ninja prior to getting geared. The problem with drg in comparison to mnk and nin is that the only place they shine in is bursting. DRG's sustain is trash compared to mnk's and subpar compared to nin's. In your video you end the parse right after you burst and your video is only a 3min parse which shows nothing in terms of sustained damage on prolonged fights.

Parsing more than 3 sets of B4B is redundant on drg on a target dummy, 9/10 times you need either tp song or goad to dps continuously for 5 minutes. Also the dps evens out around 3 b4bs so with 100% uptime you maintain the numbers I have shown. This simply doesn't happen as there is at least 1-2 globals of breaktime in nearly all encounters that regens enough tp to continue. For sustained dps at 5 minutes even if a monk starts to shine at that point they would be tp starved so unless a ninja or bard is present at the dummy tp will drain.

And as far as 700 dps burst on NIN while under i110 I don't believe it.

[siverstorm]

Parsing more than 3 sets of B4B is redundant on drg on a target dummy, 9/10 times you need either tp song or goad to dps continuously for 5 minutes. Also the dps evens out around 3 b4bs so with 100% uptime you maintain the numbers I have shown. This simply doesn't happen as there is at least 1-2 globals of breaktime that regens enough tp to continue. For sustained dps at 5 minutes even if a monk starts to shine at that point they would be tp starved so unless a ninja or bard is present at the dummy tp will drain.

I don't want to start throwing insults but you literally do not understand what sustained dps is this entire conversation is pointless.