Myth Message being used to excluded players

[Ozaro]

They at least have the ability to find a way to get a clear that doesn't involve wasting the time of other players via lack of experience.



Because you haven't put in enough time to clear it, and still haven't? Or spent the time and energy in a way that was not steady progress? Crying about it on forums isn't a productive method to clear stuff, it's just venting and looking for support for what is ultimately an insufficient amount of effort.

Um... paying for a clear does NOT mean they know anything at all. Hell, they couldve been dead the whole fight for all you know. They may lack experience, go join your farm party and after seeing no tome messages you continue and wipe multiple times. Now your time is wasted thx to your "simple way to weed out the players who lack experience"

Stop going around in inconsistent circles, its nonsense. Also, no one cares about your farm party "standards" its not relevant, so stop mentioning it.

[NovaUltimatum]

The initial notification should be removed to stop both forms of abuse.

This won't work. If people are adamant about having people who have cleared already joining their group, then they will ask for item proof or lodestone achievements as they did before the myth/soldiery message was introduced. They're only using the current process as it's the fastest available.

[Amelia_Pond_Behemoth]

While I still stand by my original post where someone is allowed whatever standards in their PF they care for, they still have the responsibility of being a polite human being, and the more of the posts I read in here, the less convinced I am that everyone is doing that. Yes, you have the right to refuse entry of someone who has not cleared the fight. It's a gamble if they tell you they know the fight. I get that. But the blanket statement about those who have not cleared is petty. Please do not assume that everyone who has yet to clear is equally inexperienced as someone brand new to the fight.

[EricCartmenez]

Let me get this straight - so if you don't see the message and everyone has cleared the fight at least once (cause you don't get a number) you're assuming that the individuals in your farm party are up to the challenge? Hmm... How about the people who paid to get carried? How about the people who had their brothers running it for them that day? What about the people who just got lucky and got a great party who got through regardless of their poor skills? Sorry, but I don't see how this message says anything. I went through EX fights where the party was just awful. Sometimes we got close (within a percent) and sometimes it was better to just watch the party fall apart. When I finally cleared, I was able to do most of these fights with my eyes closed and ear-plugs. But that didn't mean that I wasn't ready for a clear and wasn't familiar several parties prior. It just meant that there were 7 other people there who were completely clueless. It happens.

[Snugglebutt]

This won't work. If people are adamant about having people who have cleared already joining their group, then they will ask for item proof or lodestone achievements as they did before the myth/soldiery message was introduced. They're only using the current process as it's the fastest available.

Not sure what you mean by won't work in the sense it is a part of a larger feature currently being abused in multiple ways and not just in PF listings. It's (notification) removal at the start of a run will stop the abuse of that specific part of the feature. In fact your reply goes further in my arguments favor by admitting that specific notification not being present would not be detrimental to people filtering groups given they can use other methods for filtering.

Will it stop people making stupid requirements in PF? No, but it will stop people using/abusing this one in PF listings alongside stopping people from using/abusing it in an effort to fish for soldiery bonus only parties, ditching or asking to get vote kicked, forcing a vote kick by causing wipes or vote abandoning at the start of a run because no bonus notification popped up. The principle behind giving a soldiery bonus to help people complete content is great, it is merely the notification at the start of a run which is doing more harm than good.

By removing the soldiery notification at the beginning of a run it will resolve both current forms of abuse on that feature even if its removal does not fix everything else or many other problems with the game. If a problem consists of multiple issues, removing or resolving one issue from the list of contributing issues that make up the problem is better to do than doing nothing at all. I am not saying remove the feature itself aka bonus given to parties with players who have not yet got the clear, I am saying remove the 'initial notification' which is the part people are abusing while keeping the feature of giving bonus soldiery itself present and the notification at the end of a run present.

As far as I am concerned this is a no brainer type issue, simply using an ounce of common sense SE should be able to see the notification at the start of a run needs to be removed. The notification at the end of a run is not a problem and cannot be abused so remove the former and keep the latter. They might have intended that initial notification to be used for good but it is not being used as such by a large amount of people.

Even if SE did not agree with my argument about PF parties abusing the features initial notification which was intended to help people do content and not misused in an effort to exclude people from content...the fact remains the notification at the start of a run fosters and encourages the same problem as they wanted to reduce in terms of dungeon/raid/trial fishing only now people are using soldiery notification at the start of a DF run to decide whether to ditch, force a vote kick or abandon in runs when the notification does not pop up.

[Amelia_Pond_Behemoth]

I present another scenario. What about people who play more than once character? One character may have the win, but another may not.

[Snugglebutt]

I present another scenario. What about people who play more than once character? One character may have the win, but another may not.

I can attest to that, I also have two separate characters (the one you see me posting on to the left and a female one which is a level 50 monk) and I might have cleared something on one but not the other. There are a vast amount of flaws with people abusing the soldiery notification at start of a run. This is just one more flaw to add to a long list of previously discussed ones.

[NovaUltimatum]

I think I see your point now, you're making the case for content that uses DF matching right? My previous comment was purely based on filtering made for full pre-made recruitments.

[Snugglebutt]

I think I see your point now, you're making the case for content that uses DF matching right? My previous comment was purely based on filtering made for full pre-made recruitments.

My overall point is the need to remove the notification at the start of a run because it is open to abuse and being abused in multiple ways whether through ignorance in it's use for PF requirements, doing the opposite of what it was designed for aka not working as intended and it's abuse in DF runs, trials and raids. Some people chose to argue with me in regards to the use in PF listings, none of their arguments to date in that regard hold much merit and I have countered them already in previous pages but my point and my issue with this feature is the 'initial notification' and encompasses more than PF listings alone even if people tended to focus on that aspect in the last few pages.

[Sessurea]

I remember the myth message used as a witch hunt when I was DFing levi ex to learn it. Some A-hole tank ( I hope he's reading this... ) at the start said "where are you mr 100 myth....".

But it's complete BS. DF is there for everyone. PF is there to make a party with player created limitations.