DRG has been broken for far too long. Fix it SE

[Tyrn]

our Magic Defense.

Yeah it's pretty bad when as you said most party damage that goes on someone other than the tank is magic, almost makes me think the people who decided on this were thinking like this.

[RiceisNice]

lolwat

I always knew DRG's magic defense was pretty miserable...but wow.

[kyrios91]

I always knew DRG's magic defense was pretty miserable...but wow.

Which is very absurd. Lore-wise we are elite knights trained with the sole purpose to fight dragons and dragons wield magical powers! Technically we should have high MDEF (My i110 DRG has around 680 DEF now so at least we should have 600ish MDEF). But in-game our gears' MDEF is lower than a crafter body? "Oh yeah that wool apron that you can buy in the market has better resistance against magic compared to this cuirass that was made by the Allagan engineers for their lancer unit".

[Zirael_Foxfire]

I don't even play DRG, but I agree. Lowest mDEF, positional combo requirements, animation locks, no Fists of Earth or Perfect Dodge...

[Kyrosiris]

I always knew DRG's magic defense was pretty miserable...but wow.

Yeah, it's fucking dire. When Ramuh EX first came out, if our DRG was charmed, two Thunderstorms with one or more balls on the field killed him. Point blank. Like, if he didn't have Apocatastasis or I didn't Virus and we didn't notice a stray ball or an overlapping Thunderstorm, he was smoked.

It's not as bad now with more gear but jesus.

[Jubez187]

I like how DRG is loaded with positional requirements. It gives a big risk/reward. But for DPS so volatile, what are you rewarded with for getting all your positionals? Lesser than MNK and NIN dps.

[Sleigh]

There is no mechanic in this game that prevents flank/rear unless it locks you in place (eg bind in T8), forces a specific movement (eg shriek in T7), or stops you all together (gaols/conflags etc). As for T11, most strats I see have tanks teathered in front obviously, and, lets say tanks are north or 12 oclock, other 2 groups on the flank/rear split around 8 and 4. That places non-tanks essentically on the line of flank/rear which is the exact place mnks and drgs want to be. If your group is forcing you to stand off to the side 90 degrees at 3 or 6 and never move then work with your group. Its doable.

In T11 when you get tethered you have to stand 180 degrees from the other tether set, and to make dodging easier it's pretty common to stack even if not tethered so the first aimed Nerve is on a tether group for sure. It's not as simple as position tanks here, melee there. Also, Nerve Gas, you have to take what you can get as you try to survive and not run into the other group. Also, you can't take any liberties at all when you're tethered, no stealing positionals when you can or you will kill you and your partner.

The worst thing that happens is a single GCD (the reapplication of HT or DIS) will not have the effect on the actual HT or DIS, but it will be up for everything else.

The problem isn't missing one GCD. It's missing 2+, which is actually pretty common when a mechanic forces you to miss a positional (T8, T9, T10, T11, most of the specific mechanics that force you to go to specific spots require you there for more than 3 seconds, especially T11. If it was just one GCD every time, you're right, it wouldn't be as bad as we're saying ... but it is). That's when it goes into terrible territory, when you're skipping CT for a whole rotation or doing an unbuffed FT combo.

Is it so unreasonable to ask to be screwed over equally with the only other two classes of its kind in the same position? The potency loss alone is enough. As long as SE makes mechanics based on your character moving in/out of a mechanic while still expected to attack the boss, this will always be something against DRG whereas MNK/NIN get a slap on the wrist. In fact, if they buff DRG to near MNK/NIN levels via more DPS and MDEF, the positional requirement could in fact STILL deter DRG from being brought to now and future fights.

[WhiteDragon]

Let everyone pop theyr CD/Potions during that +10%... you will understand

Are you the type of guy that thinks healers should only heal during mantra too?

[Ephier]

For monks, this dps floor is not as far from their ceiling.

Are you serious? Monks have the LOWEST dps floor, and the highest ceiling. If you drop GL your dmg plummets. All Monk skills have a positional requirement, and while you may still be able to combo while not at these positionals the dmg you are doing is significantly decreased.

Through utility? no. ...(snip)... Dragoons have…. nothing.

As mentioned in many previous posts, you have the ability to increasing a bards damage by 10% over the course of an entire fight. That is significant. You also have access to untraited mantra which I see Alot of people scoff at because "its only 5%", don't matter, every bit helps.

Dragoons are punished for failing positionals much more harshly than monks or ninjas, meaning that mistakes made by a dragoon lower their dps output even further below a monk or ninja that makes the same mistakes.

Yes, you are and should be. Each job has its own form of a punishment system. Monks take 9 GCDs to ramp up, 9, and failure to maintain that ramp up (whether due to being bad or because of mechanics, conflags in twin for example) causes your damage to drop abysmally low. Ninjas have the mudra system which is on the surface quite simple, every 20 seconds you have the chance to cast ninjutsu, but while you are casting you may do nothing else. Now we introduce ping, button smashing and other various bad habits that turn you into bunny Ninja, effectively locking you out of your mudras for another 20 seconds (25 if you too ashamed to slap your mudra key and become a bunny). Now for Dragoon we have the positional combo starters and damage boosts, heavy thrust and impulse drive. Missing these 2 causes your damage to fall quite significantly as well, but you only have to hit the first part of the combo as the positional. Heavy Thrust (side), Impulse Drive (back), disembowel (where ever you want), Chaos Thrust (where ever you want). Now if you look at that you only have 3 GCDs to get up to full power. 3 compared to a Monks 9. I will agree that Ninja has almost no ramp up as it is able to prebuff before a pull, but their only draw back is trick attack, their main raid utility to boost everyone's damage by 10% falls into the same category of your impulse drive/disembowel dilemma, and theirs is only usable once every 60 seconds. If you do not hit trick attack from the back, you deliver an attack with a potency of 240 and get no 10% vulnerability up for your team.

So they do less damage, they take more damage, they have no group utility.

They do less damage as we have touch on earlier because they buff Bard damage, which in turn makes up for the damage loss. The whole magic damage argument has been going on for a long time, I am neutral on it, I do not think it is a necessary change, dragoons aren't just falling over to raid damage unless they were not topped off which is either a healer issue or the dragoon is taking extra damage from other sources than the magic damage. The group utility was touch upon earlier in the post as well, 10% piercing debuff as well as the option to use untraited mantra.

My personal opinion on the matter of Dragoon buffs? They do not need a fundamental change. Buff heavy thrust damage boost to 20% and end all the crying.

[Saint_Angeles]

Pretty hilarious to read all the posts saying "Aw hell naw DRGs are TOTALLY as strong\valued\powerful as MNK\NIN" when every reddit post\in-game conception is DRGs are scrubs, reroll MNK\NIN, loldrg, noobs who steal all the loot, etc...