Cash shop confirmed

[Tupsi]

So, all of you doom and gloom kids:

The following seasonal event items have been added to the inventories of Calamity salvager NPCs in the three city-states:
-Summer Event Items-

So about SE removing items from game and putting it on Cash Shop only....what was that again? If you did it, you're set. If you're new and missed the event, you never had access to these items to begin with. And would you look at that? 2.4 still introduces ingame mounts and minions.

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...0482c3e441d852

[Vhailor]

It is. The vanity kit will have been produced anyway, whether it be through crafting or dungeons. the difference now is the always present question of whether it'll be locked behind a second paywall. We are being robbed of content because daddy Sqaure Enix will never change, and will always try to screw over their most faithful eventually.

We can't make this judgment, as we lack any actual evidence. It's quite possible SE has additional resources focused on vanity gear because of the revenue it might bring in - resources that might not have been present were the cash shop to not exist. We simply can't analyze this effectively.

So about SE removing items from game and putting it on Cash Shop only....what was that again? If you did it, you're set. If you're new and missed the event, you never had access to these items to begin with. And would you look at that? 2.4 still introduces ingame mounts and minions.

Same goes to you, Tupsi. We have no information, and likely never will, on whether or not items are artificially placed into the cash shop when they might otherwise have been in the game normally. You're citing a single example, one which is provides virtually no evidence one way or another on the broader issue. Even a definitive statement on SE's part that all items in the cash shop will be obtainable in-game in some fashion would be insufficient, as SE could make the item artificially rare in order to encourage people to buy it.

In other words, to both of you (and the others bantering about this same topic) - we have nothing but uncertainty. There is absolutely no way to determine whether or not the cash shop will be taking away items we would have gotten otherwise. None. Any objective analysis (not that there's been much of it) must focus on other aspects of the cash shop that we can make some concrete predictions about, predictions which are independent of SE's internal development decisions.

[Kyoraki]

El Snip

Odin Mount. We all knew it was coming eventually. And now it is, as a cash shop exclusive. And looking at Sqaure Enix's behaviour for the past entire console generation, is it really a wise idea to give the company the benefit of the doubt? It seems more and more that ARR was a fluke, not the company turning a new leaf.

[Vhailor]

Odin Mount. We all knew it was coming eventually. And now it is, as a cash shop exclusive. And looking at Sqaure Enix's behaviour for the past entire console generation, is it really a wise idea to give the company the benefit of the doubt? It seems more and more that ARR was a fluke, not the company turning a new leaf.

We didn't "know" Sleipnir was going to be implemented. We didn't "know" that it was going to be available via traditional means within FFXIV. It could have been a bonus item for preordering Heavensward, or a bonus item from attending a future Fan Festival.

Again, don't mistake this as a defense of the cash shop - I abhor its existence, and I think FFXIV will be all the worse for it. I don't plan on giving the title another shot, in part because the cash shop served as a last straw of sorts. If you're objective, though, you simply cannot argue against it in the way you've chosen. It's all speculation. You might feel that it's reasonable speculation, but there's not a shred of proof, and there likely never will be.

Edit / Addition: I do agree with your assessment that SE has given us numerous reasons not to trust them if you look at the company's behaviour over the last several years. This is one of the reasons why I suspect the cash shop will eventually morph beyond its current, vanity-only type of setup, though the progress will likely be slow. This just can't be used as objective evidence, not at the moment.

I don't think ARR was a fluke, either, because taken in context, I don't think the title was all that great even upon release. I, at least, excused a lot of flaws due to the fact that it was just being launched, but subsequent behaviour on SE's part has indicated to me the flaws may well have simply been bad design. It had its moments, sure, but a lot of stuff "looked good" only because it was brand new - and much of it hasn't survived the test of time terribly well, in my estimation.

[ApolloGenX]

We didn't "know" Sleipnir was going to be implemented. We didn't "know" that it was going to be available via traditional means within FFXIV. It could have been a bonus item for preordering Heavensward, or a bonus item from attending a future Fan Festival.

But we do have the following 3 options :

1. Believe it wasn't intended for cash shop and therefor was taken away from one of those traditional means of acquisition -or-
2. SE originally planned to have a cash shop and didn't tell players... in which case their lack of transparency makes the prospects for the shop more dubious
3. SE wasn't going to give out the mount, but decided to do so, only because they could get money out of it in the cash shop (again see #2 on transparency and intention for the shop)

None of these three options is exactly "good". Yet one has to be true.

Also, imo this could be equal to P2W if the shop has cooler stuff than what's in game. With story mode options... the only real reason to do high end content is for cool looking gear. Well, if the cash shop stuff has a cooler skin... then there's no point in high end stuff. The vanity looks cooler, so you wouldn't see that gear, anyway... and it's not necessary, since you have to beat the high end to get it... so it makes that kind of pointless. Just my opinion.

I am sure some would disagree... especially if they have titles or something that you could get, that the shop wouldn't have. Then that would be something visible.

[Moqi]

Also, imo this could be equal to P2W if the shop has cooler stuff than what's in game.

This game has 1 raid only and everything else is vanity but somehow vanity isn't that important...

[Edli]

It could have been a bonus item for preordering Heavensward, or a bonus item from attending a future Fan Festival.

Or a prize from the odin fight we're getting soon which would be common sense.

[Vhailor]

But we do have the following 3 options :

1. Believe it wasn't intended for cash shop and therefor was taken away from one of those traditional means of acquisition -or-
2. SE originally planned to have a cash shop and didn't tell players... in which case their lack of transparency makes the prospects for the shop more dubious
3. SE wasn't going to give out the mount, but decided to do so, only because they could get money out of it in the cash shop (again see #2 on transparency and intention for the shop)

None of these three options is exactly "good". Yet one has to be true.

Also, imo this could be equal to P2W if the shop has cooler stuff than what's in game. With story mode options... the only real reason to do high end content is for cool looking gear. Well, if the cash shop stuff has a cooler skin... then there's no point in high end stuff. The vanity looks cooler, so you wouldn't see that gear, anyway... and it's not necessary, since you have to beat the high end to get it... so it makes that kind of pointless. Just my opinion.

I am sure some would disagree... especially if they have titles or something that you could get, that the shop wouldn't have. Then that would be something visible.

Edit: Adjusted argument.

Firstly, I would disagree somewhat with your initial contention that one of three options has to be true. The thinking is too black-and-white; for all we know, there's a reskinned Sleipnir mount planned as an in-game reward soon, and this was merely intended to be a promotional item for a business venture.

Either way, I don't view (2) and (3) as being "bad" so much as entirely irrelevant. Arguments surrounding the cash shop are best made when they focus on objective influences it will have on FFXIV, either positive or negative. How SE conducts themselves on the business level does not directly impact FFXIV. There is a possible indirect impact, but again, it's speculation. Arguments of this sort simply lead to mindless back-and-forth debate between people on either side - not exactly the definition of constructive.

On the other hand, your argument about the cash shop representing a P2W element for those who consider looking pretty as a significant component of "winning" - that's a powerful argument. That is indisputable. It doesn't depend upon some vague notion of a nefarious company out to exploit its users (vs. those on the other side who simply view it as being opportunistic). Those are the types of objective arguments that can be used effectively against the idea of a cash shop. Those contribute meaningfully to the discussion.

Or a prize from the odin fight we're getting soon which would be common sense.

Quite possible, yes. It's also possible they're offering a reskinned Sleipnir mount for it as an alternative to the cash shop - we have no idea yet. Yet another reason why we can't exactly argue that content has been removed from the game for the purpose of the cash shop.