Hey, Sincerely Thank You SE for easing up on Coil

[Exstal]

SE obviously allows for that. You can, form your party and remove echo. Done.

Nerf is not the same as echo buff. SE does *not* allow an unnerfed version.

Yay nerfed coil so I can learn it in df, suck eggs snow flakes.

...you haven't been trying to learn it without DF (assumption on my part)? That's pretty lazy.

[NyarukoW]

Nerf is not the same as echo buff. SE does *not* allow an unnerfed version.

Use the level appropriate gear then. Do titan HM in darklight or worse gear. You don't need the old stuff preserved exactly to be equivalent. Different is not wrong or bad. It is just different.

In any case, the desire for nostalgia and doing things like it was, is NOT a valid reason to block accessibility to players trying to catch-up. The starting line has moved, and it is a new race, and people need to have a reasonable chance at lining up at the new starting line, soon to be final coil.

[Skeith-Adeline]

Nyaruko... T7, fireballing (or getting hit) a frozen (stoned) target will not kill them after this nerf. No matter what gear you're in, you cannot replicate that.

[Exstal]

Use the level appropriate gear then. Do titan HM in darklight or worse gear. You don't need the old stuff preserved exactly to be equivalent. Different is not wrong or bad. It is just different.

You're attacking the wrong portion of my comment. The person you were quoting is talking about mechanic nerfs. They want a Coil that mechanically the same as inception and, more than likely, a version that has lesser mechanics. Echo does absolutely jack in terms of mechanics. Just makes you survive longer and DPS harder than previously possible (even in same gear).

For example, my group did Binding Coil: Turn 2 with Allagan Rot. 1 Bard, 2 Paldins for silence. If we missed a silence for any reason, we were paralyzed for the 30s. No way out of it. Now? Could do it the same way, in the exact same gear, if we miss a silence can just cleanse it all off. That's never going to change.

Nyaruko... T7, fireballing (or getting hit) a frozen (stoned) target will not kill them after this nerf. No matter what gear you're in, you cannot replicate that.

Exactly the same as this.

[ReplicaX]

For example, my group did Binding Coil: Turn 2 with Allagan Rot. 1 Bard, 2 Paldins for silence. If we missed a silence for any reason, we were paralyzed for the 30s. No way out of it. Now? Could do it the same way, in the exact same gear, if we miss a silence can just cleanse it all off. That's never going to change.

T2 ADS...

I really wish SE fixed the enrage when it was discovered within the first months of release. Rot is actually a decent mechanic many ppl haven't even experienced pre and post nerf sadly.

[NyarukoW]

.... If we missed a silence for any reason, we were paralyzed for the 30s....

Nyaruko... T7, fireballing (or getting hit) a frozen (stoned) target will not kill them after this nerf. No matter what gear you're in, you cannot replicate that.

You don't need those replicated exactly. People that don't know what to do will still wipe. Surviving those a bit and giving them a bit wiggle room to recover is not a bad thing. There is already plenty going on and there is going to final coil to really put them to the test. People that don't know rot method or don't know enrage method is not clearing T2. When the renauds run loose in T7, it is a wipe.

More importantly, people need to be able to get the new content in a reasonable amount of time. Keeping things exactly as they are is simply unreasonable and unnecessary.

----------

...
Example: Garuda(Story)>Garuda(Hard)>Garuda(Extreme)....

Those are not tier-ed difficulty. It is really more like garuda, revisit of garuda, and hopefully final termination of garuda. SE was not doing tier-ed difficulty. SE puts stuff out at max difficulty they deem people would aceept and attempt and then checks and see how are people doing and what is the clear rate. Then when they have new content to take its plave, they reduce difficulty of the existing/older content. This is their operational model and it is plain to see clear as day. There is nothing wrong with the operational model. This turns older content into a part of the ramp of the learning curve. This really smart reuse of existing assets.

And people that want to be hardcore, should put in the time and/or prioritize their time to get at the latest content. There needs to be an incentive for urgency and desire to go at stuff first. You don't get to lolly-gag, drag your feet, and still claim to do the hardcore stuff years later. People that did in the time it was meant to be earned it and now needs to move on. Old victories are hollow, there is no need to be stuck in the past, nor do they get to sit on their laurels and lord it over everyone else. The hardcore player deserve the right to have an opportunity to earn their bragging right first, but they do not have the right to deny other players access to old/older content forever. People that don't feel need to be at the bleeding edge will get difficuly reduced older content, and if that is what they are happy with SE fine with that too and they can stay 1 or 2 major patches behind. But if those people want to shift gears they can get to the starting line quicker for the newer content. SE operational model is both fair and struck the right balance.

[Tiggy]

You don't need those replicated exactly. People that don't know what to do will still wipe. Surviving those a bit and giving them a bit wiggle room to recover is not a bad thing. There is already plenty going on and there is going to final coil to really put them to the test. People that don't know rot method or don't know enrage method is not clearing T2. When the renauds run loose in T7, it is a wipe.

The point was the fight isn't the same any more and simply removing echo doesn't make it exactly the same. You're making excuses. On this point you are very wrong. We'll never be able to fight it the way it was ever again.

Keeping things exactly as they are is simply unreasonable and unnecessary.

False. There are very good balance and pacing reasons to do so. Especially since the game is so young and is still low on content. This mind set you have that there is zero merit shows how little you are even considering the opposing argument. You aren't treating this like a debate with attitudes like that. It's closer to you shouting with your ears covered.

These two points show me that you don't care about other people. Only yourself and your own opinion.

There's nothing in this game that only hardcore raiding FCs can play. I'll never get why people still equate "casual" to "low skill".

People refuse to let go of their prejudice and stereotypes. The same way those casual/low skilled players always call raiders elitists or toxic. Like either group is described so simply. It's the most embarrassing part of this community, and all MMO communities tbh. A complete lack of understanding for other human beings and differing view points.

[ReplicaX]

People refuse to let go of their prejudice and stereotypes. The same way those casual/low skilled players always call raiders elitists or toxic. Like either group is described so simply. It's the most embarrassing part of this community, and all MMO communities tbh. A complete lack of understanding for other human beings and differing view points.

While playing yesterday, this topic was brought up via shouts on Excalibur in North Shroud from a player that lost their temper here. They still had the same general attitude and view point, yet didn't care for and ignored different view points from others. It died and ppl just changed the topic of discussion.

[Tiggy]

While playing yesterday, this topic was brought up via shouts on Excalibur in North Shroud from a player that lost their temper here. They still had the same general attitude and view point, yet didn't care for and ignored different view points from others. It died and ppl just changed the topic of discussion.

It would help if people wouldn't be so defensive and resort immediately to prejudices and stereotypes to sling insults at one another. I mean really look at the two threads on the front page talking about this topic and you see the insults and hyperbole used everywhere in the place of actual conversation and understanding. The Casual-Raider or Lowskill-Highskill divide is as close to outright racism as we get in this game. I wish there was more middle difficulty content so that people could shift from the lowskill group and start working their way to the high skill group. Until upward mobility becomes easier we're just going to continue having these issues. Honestly If skill were the economy then I'd say we are in desperate need of a middle class.

[NyarukoW]

...
People refuse to let go of their prejudice and stereotypes. The same way those casual/low skilled players always call raiders elitists or toxic. Like either group is described so simply. ....

Yet you choose to stereotype casual/low skilled players (case in point in your words above). The vast majority of newer players and newbies do NOT know enough to attempt to treat anyone else with ridicule or contempt. They only respond when they realize someone is working to block them and making their path more difficult. Whereas there a select group of loud and vocal experienced players actively seeking to make it hard for rest of the player base, they even go as far as asking for "no newbies wanted" checkbox, and look to exclude people when the myth bonus shows up, and force 1st-timers to skip their cutscenes, etc. etc. New player don't start out like that, those are learned behavior of experienced players. And who else but the experienced players with T9 on farm has the audacity to sell SCOB turns for 60 mil.

SE has the data for both clear rates and subscription rates. They know the that keeping things as they are is both unreasonable and unnecessary, and they will adjust difficulty level of old content as scheduled when they have new content to replace them, because it will help the game and their finances. It is a win-win for them and this a valid position, you have been unable to prove this false.

...
False. There are very good balance and pacing reasons to do so. Especially since the game is so young and is still low on content. This mind set you have that there is zero merit shows how little you are even considering the opposing argument.

False? It is your faulty logic and invalid claims. I read an considered your rants, but I am under no obligations to accept your incorrect opinions. And even in a simple statement like this you fail to separate your subjective opinion about "young" and "low" from fact. And even if I grant you that false premise, SE is still well within their right to add new content and reduce existing content difficulty, since the simple fact remains that the orignial BCOB was given this treatment when there was less content for sure and did so to great success.